Newbie looking at PB questions

[Tenaja]

Newbie questions... thanks in advance.

I want to make a special purpose text editor for cnc code. These are my goals:
1. Single exe file. (one per o/s is fine.)
2. No "installation" required; just run from a thumb drive, for both Linux & Win, and preferably Mac, too.
3. Use the same source code (although Includes with o/s dependent code is acceptable.)
4. Support for Plug-ins

questions...
5. Are these reasonable expectations?
6. How difficult is it to use the same program for cross-compiling for all of the supported languages?
7. Is the 64k string size limit still active? I read about it on the PowerBasic site, but it was a 2005 post.
8. Why are almost all of the links bad? Even some in the FAQ are no longer valid. Is this a training-wheel compiler that people ditch after a year?
9. What is the BEST editor and GUI editor?

To be honest, I'd lean towards PowerBasic if it weren't for the multi-o/s support. It seems that Pure's strength is game support, but I'm not interested in them.

Thanks!

[netmaestro]

Is this a training-wheel compiler that people ditch after a year?

Nope, not even close. I'd have more to say on your other queries if I didn't find this line so annoying.

[LuCiFeR[SD]]

Newbie questions... thanks in advance.
<sic>
To be honest, I'd lean towards PowerBasic if it weren't for the multi-o/s support. It seems that Pure's strength is game support, but I'm not interested in them.

Thanks!

Then I suggest you check again. but if that's how you feel (cause I'm not going to try and stop ya)... Don't forget to close the door quietly on your way out.

[c4s]

questions...
5. Are these reasonable expectations?
6. How difficult is it to use the same program for cross-compiling for all of the supported languages?
7. Is the 64k string size limit still active? I read about it on the PowerBasic site, but it was a 2005 post.
8. Why are almost all of the links bad? Even some in the FAQ are no longer valid. Is this a training-wheel compiler that people ditch after a year?
9. What is the BEST editor and GUI editor?

To be honest, I'd lean towards PowerBasic if it weren't for the multi-o/s support. It seems that Pure's strength is game support, but I'm not interested in them.

5. Yes, very much
6. Not difficult if you use the build-in functions, normally nothing to do at all
7. Don't know, probably no but I could be wrong
8. Take a look at the changelog, PureBasic is getting more and more features on a regular basis
9. Best editor: Build-in IDE, GUI: Take a look at PureForm from gnozal, you'll find it here on the forum
10. PureBasic easily outshines PowerBasic, but you'll have to find this out by yourself

[Demivec]

7. Is the 64k string size limit still active? I read about it on the PowerBasic site, but it was a 2005 post.
8. Why are almost all of the links bad? Even some in the FAQ are no longer valid. Is this a training-wheel compiler that people ditch after a year?

7. Definitely not still active. Get the demo and prove it to yourself by creating a large string.
8. The links are bad because more time is spent on the language than on the links. To answer your t-w compiler question, look at recent postings in the forum and check the dates the posters joined the forum. I agree with the sentiments of the first responses; namely, that your eyes must not be opened very much if you had to post that question in the first place.

[PB]

> Single exe file. (one per o/s is fine.)

One per OS is all you can create with ANY language.

> No "installation" required; just run from a thumb drive

Yes.

> Use the same source code (although Includes with o/s dependent code is acceptable.)

Yes.

> Support for Plug-ins

Not sure what you mean, but PureBasic can use any DLL out there,
and import other third-party libraries for use. Which plug-ins do you
mean, specifically?

> Are these reasonable expectations?

Yes.

> How difficult is it to use the same program for cross-compiling for
> all of the supported languages?

Not very. If you use what's in the manual, then it's very easy, because
you won't be using platform-specific functions like Win32 API calls.

> Is the 64k string size limit still active? I read about it on the PowerBasic site

No. Strings can be any size. This is evident at PureBasic's official site
in the release history. Surely you read there for PureBasic info, rather
than relying on a competitor's dated information?

> Why are almost all of the links bad?

Because the internet is dynamic and links change.

> Is this a training-wheel compiler that people ditch after a year?

No. In fact, everything that you asked for above, CANNOT be done
with Visual Basic.NET, so what do you think about that? Not bad, eh?

> What is the BEST editor and GUI editor?

Only you can answer that. What I like, you'll hate, and vice versa.

> It seems that Pure's strength is game support

It's both games and apps.

[netmaestro]

This is an all-too-common and readily-identifiable class of thread created by a lazybones who lacks the initiative to investigate the capabilities and historical path of a compiler and chooses instead to toss out a few derogatory remarks about it in the hope that ardent fans will leap to the defence and enumerate its many strengths and spoonfeed him a detailed comparison of PureBasic-vs-PowerBasic. Sorry - I'm not playing. This thread should have been locked within the first hour. Sigfried - where are you?

[PB]

I know, netmaestro. I found it soooo hard to stay civil and not go
off the deep end like I did with the last such thread.

[Tenaja]

I know, netmaestro. I found it soooo hard to stay civil and not go
off the deep end like I did with the last such thread.

Me, too! The junior-high mentality on this forum borders on pathetic. Guys like you who get all emotional when real questions are posed is pathetic. In fact, the forum content was a bigger deterring factor than the product itself! Heck, I would have probably been less apprehensive had there been no forum.

But, with guys like c4s, dhouston, and TomS who had the civility to overlook a low glucose idiotic mistake on my part, I just might still consider it. I'm not normally a pita on forums, but those other guys (netmaestro, LuCiFeR) are like the little junior high girls in the neighborhood. Little princesses with their leotards in a bunch.

[Tenaja]

c4s,
Thanks for your informative response! That was very helpful.

FWIW, since I'm introducing myself in this fun & controversial way ( ) I'll say Hello, and let everybody know that I'm not generally a pain. I do apologize for the unintentionally condescending tone of "training wheels." I don't get emotional about my tools, one way or the other. I think the speaker is ignorant when they say C is better because it's compiled and Basic isn't, but I don't take it personal. OTOH, once in a while I appreciate a good pair of training wheels, myself! I've got a few collecting dust in my garage!




BTW, At least 5 of these 13 links are dead, from purebasic.com links page:
PureBasic Resources

Official PureBasic blog Official PureBasic blog
Programming 2D Scrolling Games 'Programming 2D Scrolling Games' Book For PureBasic
Pure Basic Resources site PureBasic Resources site (User-Libs, Code-Snippets, GUI builders & much more)
Pure Basic support site PureArea.net (New Pure Basic Support Site)
The visual editor website for the Pure Basic compiler PureVision (Visual form editor)
Pure Basic tutorials Robsite - PureBasic Tutorials
Microsoft Windows API support Microsoft Windows API support
VirtualBox OSE (MacOS X) VirtualBox OSE (MacOS X Build)

Private websites dedicated to PureBasic

Andrea's Pure Basic Site Andrea's PureBasic Site (german)
Berikco's Place Berikco's Place
Pure Basic libraries and stuff Doobrey Net
Freak's Pure Basic Place Freak's PureBasic Place
Horst Schaeffer Pure Basic page Horst Schaeffer

[LuCiFeR[SD]]

<sic> but those other guys (netmaestro, LuCiFeR) are like the little junior high girls in the neighborhood. Little princesses with their leotards in a bunch.

I look quite good in a leotard I'll have you know.

[blueznl]

Even the thought hurts...

[LuCiFeR[SD]]

Even the thought hurts...

Liar

[c4s]

c4s,
Thanks for your informative response! That was very helpful.

No problem. I help where I can.
Anyway, I recommend you to check PureBasic out for maybe a week or so: try the examples, study the detailed changelog (it's in the demo), read the blog, check out some nice codes you can find here on the forum (e.g. at "Tips and tricks" or "Applications - Feedback and Discussion") etc.
Deciding for a specific programming language isn't something you can do from comparing a list of differences. You have to feel the pure power of each language and then find out what more fits to your needs...

BTW, At least 5 of these 13 links are dead, from purebasic.com links page

Sometimes the developers (mainly Fred and Freak) spend too much time on making PureBasic even better.
Well seriously, I really think this should be fixed. Shouldn't take too long and just confuses potential new users. I bet they lost a few purchases just because of this. Would I be here if they were dead like 3 years ago...

[dhouston]

BTW, At least 5 of these 13 links are dead, from purebasic.com links page:
PureBasic Resources

I'm sure it would make a better first impression if the team would try to keep the main web page updated (most links were working when I first looked at PB). It would also help if they would police the forums (just a wee bit more) to discourage the bully-boy attacks on newbies (nearly always by the usual suspects). That said, the PB team is small and mostly part-time so it's somewhat miraculous that they have accomplished so much in building PB into a very powerful cross-platform tool. The forum has an Ignore feature so you can flag the unhelpful responders and never have to be bothered by them again.

The one link I found most valuable is the PureArea.net - Code Archive which has lots of code covering nearly every aspect of the language. I found some of the code in the Windows section (not MS Windows but windows in general) especially helpful in understanding how to structure a program. While I've used ZBasic (cross platform back in CP/M, Apple II, early DOS and pre-Linux days), VB, Delphi, PowerBasic and RealBasic, I find I really prefer PB and I haven't even tried any of the Visual tools, preferring to code everything manually (and most of the visual tools are Windows only). Once you see how to create your first window, you are well on your way.

Others may recommend a different approach but, as I was already experienced with the Windows API, I created my app under Windows and then ported the (mostly completed) code to Linux and finally to OSX. I found it easier to deal with platform specific issues that way as opposed to jumping from OS to OS to OS while writing new code that was still unproven on any OS. YMMV.

I'm assuming you are already familiar with the MS Knowledge Base and other tools. Linux uses GTK+ for most of the underlying nuts & bolts. There are a couple of excellent GTK tutorials on the web. I have referenced them a couple of times in the Linux forums. A search should find them. (BTW, the forum's native search is rather sucky - a PB user has created add-on search based on Google that works with several browsers to search the forums here.) I am far less familiar with the OSX API but a user has compiled several examples and posted the list to the OSX forum. Also, freak recently put together a table listing the underlying elements of the various APIs. It's in the PB Blog.

I also found Kale's book on PB invaluable. He's no longer updating it but has made it public domain (?) and there is a PDF version. I'm old school and prefer hard copy myself. A search will turn up many references.

Lastly, while I do not offer my coding style as an example to follow, I recently put my ~5300 line OSX code on my web page and referenced it in the OSX forum asking other PPC users to verify the problems I encountered. (The code runs under OSX Intel and is nearly identical to working Linux and Windows versions.) It will show you one approach to structuring a large program.