A few months ago after some major incidents in my local area with some professional thieves successfully
bypassing some alarm systems in various local businesses, I approached the "powers that be" within my industry
trying to find an answer to solve this problem. The answer was a resounding " No there is just simply nothing that can be
done to stop this style of attack".
I just could not agree with this & so set out to solve it myself, which after a couple of weeks of writing code &
throwing it in the bin, I dreamt up the tiniest piece which very simply solves this problem. When I tested this code I
was hoping for a speed of around 300 clients per minute per thread, but much to my surprise & after a little refining,
my code block returned results from a single thread instance in the order of around 1,800 clients per minute.
At this point I have approached my solicitor for advice & placed a quick copyright on the codeblock.
At the end of this, we had come up with the idea of going directly to the developers of monitoring centre software and
giving the codeblock to them so they can incorporate into their existing softwares based on the idea I would claim an
ongoing royalty on any client who elects to use this service.
All sounds good yes?
At this point I have been sitting on my hands regards this codeblock as I am seeing it as a case of when developers see
my little demo program in action they will think " how simple is this!!" & then simply write their own code without need
to even take a look at my source, thereby effectively stealing my idea & at the same time bypassing any copyright
issues leaving me as usual gaining nothing from the whole excersize.
Have any of you ever had any experience with this sort of thing that may be able to offer any sort of advice before I race out
& hand my code over to others & end up with nothing from the whole excersize?
What to do?
Ok, as for previous experience of this situation, i have none. But i can always offer my opinion on the best method of approach.
When proposing your idea, first say to them the benifits of your solution, don't say what it is, how it works right away, tell them what it will be able to acomplish and how it would be an improvement over their current solution (do your homework).
Don't talk to their development teams only talk to management, the people who have the power to say yes or no, also talking to programmers, they are more likly to be able to visualise how to remake it and effectivly steal your idea.
After telling them how it will help, ask if they are still intrested and how much they would expect to have to pay for something that would do this all for them. After they have confirmed that they are intrested, let them in a bit more into it, remember they will want to know details as security is a very sensitive subject, tell them information but not give away all your secrets. Tell them you are capable of guiding their development team on implementing the codeblock.
Very important, don't price yourself out. An unattractive price will mean that they have seen a lot of your idea's and are completely un-itrested in paying you that amount for them. So you go away empty handed and they go away with an intresting idea
Good luck
When proposing your idea, first say to them the benifits of your solution, don't say what it is, how it works right away, tell them what it will be able to acomplish and how it would be an improvement over their current solution (do your homework).
Don't talk to their development teams only talk to management, the people who have the power to say yes or no, also talking to programmers, they are more likly to be able to visualise how to remake it and effectivly steal your idea.
After telling them how it will help, ask if they are still intrested and how much they would expect to have to pay for something that would do this all for them. After they have confirmed that they are intrested, let them in a bit more into it, remember they will want to know details as security is a very sensitive subject, tell them information but not give away all your secrets. Tell them you are capable of guiding their development team on implementing the codeblock.
Very important, don't price yourself out. An unattractive price will mean that they have seen a lot of your idea's and are completely un-itrested in paying you that amount for them. So you go away empty handed and they go away with an intresting idea
Good luck
@TrondTrond wrote:How would code stop physical thieves?
It won't stop them physically doing anything, it will however alart the monitoring centre that an attack is happening so they in turn can dispatch security staff, police, etc to investigate & hopefully catch the theives in action.
@ Tommeh,
Yes thats very much the lines I am looking at using. The unfortunate part about where I am looking is that the general manager of the company I am wanting to approach is actually a full blown developer, so there is no point trying to pull the wool over his eyes.
Well, since there was a major uproar about software patents (very understandably) there is no way to prevent them from stealing your idea. But also bare in mind that if your talking quiet a bit of coding needed to create this codeblock, then not only will it take a while for them to recreate it (costs time & money) but you could propose this prospect to many other security companys in the time it would take for them to remake it.
[EDIT] You could always use something a lot of freelance programmers are very familier with, an NDA (Non disclosure agreement) or an adaption of. Basically put the benifits over to them, if they seem intrested, get them to sign an agreement not to use or disclose the information (you can get your solicitor to help) so that if they do not want to use your idea then you can be rest assured that if they do use it, they are in breach of the agreement.
[EDIT] You could always use something a lot of freelance programmers are very familier with, an NDA (Non disclosure agreement) or an adaption of. Basically put the benifits over to them, if they seem intrested, get them to sign an agreement not to use or disclose the information (you can get your solicitor to help) so that if they do not want to use your idea then you can be rest assured that if they do use it, they are in breach of the agreement.
Thanks Tommeh for your advise.
I think I have in reality 2 options.
1. turn my demo into a full blown application & set up in a couple of smaller monitoring centres as stand alone systems & just ignore the big fish until they work out what I have got.
2. Go to the big boys from the start & just hope they are willing to do the right thing by me.
Meanwhile, I do know 1 person in sydney who owns a company designing & manufacturing electronic security equipment. I do hold a lot of respect for this person, so i think he may be my best avenue for advise / support to get something worthwhile out of this idea.
fwiw:
The code block I have come up with is in reality incredibly simple & only uses a few API calls using a pre-defined Windows Structure, which is why I say any developer who see's it in action would immediately know exactly what I have done & how to replicate it into existing monitoring software. - Hence the reason why I am being somewhat on the vague side of what it is I have written
When I look at this code I still shake my head at the simplicity of it & just can't for the life of me work out why it hasn't been done in the industry already!
I think I have in reality 2 options.
1. turn my demo into a full blown application & set up in a couple of smaller monitoring centres as stand alone systems & just ignore the big fish until they work out what I have got.
2. Go to the big boys from the start & just hope they are willing to do the right thing by me.
Meanwhile, I do know 1 person in sydney who owns a company designing & manufacturing electronic security equipment. I do hold a lot of respect for this person, so i think he may be my best avenue for advise / support to get something worthwhile out of this idea.
fwiw:
The code block I have come up with is in reality incredibly simple & only uses a few API calls using a pre-defined Windows Structure, which is why I say any developer who see's it in action would immediately know exactly what I have done & how to replicate it into existing monitoring software. - Hence the reason why I am being somewhat on the vague side of what it is I have written
When I look at this code I still shake my head at the simplicity of it & just can't for the life of me work out why it hasn't been done in the industry already!
Just off the top of my head, I am guessing that perhaps you are using web cams already attached to computers to look for movement and then use their modems/internet connection to contact the authorities, very simple indeed and wouldn't take a lot of programming. Just take a snapshot every couple of seconds and look for any major changes.
I could of course be a mile off.
I could of course be a mile off.
@Derek,
Your sort of close but waaay off track.
My original idea was very mch along those lines but they have all ended up in the bin when I tried the method I have used which is far, far more low tech.
I actually think that high tech is most probably the biggest reason why nobody has done what I have. ( Very much a case of the simplest things that get overlooked. )
I have now decided to contact James ( My indirect contact to the security industry association in Sydney ) to get his advice as to which direction I should take from here. I will do this in the early days of the coming week, so I will keep you posted as much as I can on progress.
Your sort of close but waaay off track.
My original idea was very mch along those lines but they have all ended up in the bin when I tried the method I have used which is far, far more low tech.
I actually think that high tech is most probably the biggest reason why nobody has done what I have. ( Very much a case of the simplest things that get overlooked. )
I have now decided to contact James ( My indirect contact to the security industry association in Sydney ) to get his advice as to which direction I should take from here. I will do this in the early days of the coming week, so I will keep you posted as much as I can on progress.
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netmaestro
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Thanks Derek,
I know I will need a lot of luck to make this happen & at the end of the day really expect not much. If it does work to anything subastantial, I think I will be heading for France in order to give Mr Fred at least a massive hangover for making this opportunity possible.
If it does bring me anything subastantial, make no mistake Fred will be getting donations he never thought possible
I know I will need a lot of luck to make this happen & at the end of the day really expect not much. If it does work to anything subastantial, I think I will be heading for France in order to give Mr Fred at least a massive hangover for making this opportunity possible.
If it does bring me anything subastantial, make no mistake Fred will be getting donations he never thought possible
Then you have to find some answers:Baldrick wrote: The code block I have come up with is in reality incredibly simple & only uses a few API calls using a pre-defined Windows Structure, which is why I say any developer who see's it in action would immediately know exactly what I have done & how to replicate it into existing monitoring software. - Hence the reason why I am being somewhat on the vague side of what it is I have written
When I look at this code I still shake my head at the simplicity of it & just can't for the life of me work out why it hasn't been done in the industry already!
1.- Isnt there (maybe in the past) really anything similar?
2.- Does it really works and don't have big cons?
If you find that your piece of code is reallistic to the needs and really can do it, BUT as its a good idea and can be done easily by oyher people... then you have to get a patent... or try to make some profit but knowinjg that will be copied if works fine.
*Patents sounds complicated (and ARE complicated) but some people makes much money from them.
Remember that, per example, one guy get the patent for pop_unders and he is making MILLION$ because big companies are paying BIG CA$H to him.
Thanks Ricardo,
My version avoids need for this exchange equipment, so massively reducing costs to all parties.
Another method currently in use is called GSM backup which is very effective but again very expensive for each client to setup & maintain, which as technology goes, the GSM mobile service is about to become defunct here in aus in favour of the new "3G" mobile network, meaning all clients currently using GSM service will need to fork out probably another $1K + to update.
It simply works, but at the same time, it really needs to be tested on a large scale before I could get overly confident. ( Availabilty of rescources is my problem for testing any further atm )
As for the patent idea, the solicitor I have already spoken to is a patent lawyer & he has advised that I would be better off using copyright with a good marketing plan.
Thanks again people, this little thread is actually giving me some idea's for my marketing, which incedently I have absolutely NO experience with...
The nearest in similarity here in Aus is a mehtod called Securitel & requires the Telco carrier to have 3rd party equipment installed at the exchange which is a. not installed at all exchanges. b. very costly to use as a service.1.- Isnt there (maybe in the past) really anything similar?
My version avoids need for this exchange equipment, so massively reducing costs to all parties.
Another method currently in use is called GSM backup which is very effective but again very expensive for each client to setup & maintain, which as technology goes, the GSM mobile service is about to become defunct here in aus in favour of the new "3G" mobile network, meaning all clients currently using GSM service will need to fork out probably another $1K + to update.
Definately no cons involved.2.- Does it really works and don't have big cons?
It simply works, but at the same time, it really needs to be tested on a large scale before I could get overly confident. ( Availabilty of rescources is my problem for testing any further atm )
As for the patent idea, the solicitor I have already spoken to is a patent lawyer & he has advised that I would be better off using copyright with a good marketing plan.
Thanks again people, this little thread is actually giving me some idea's for my marketing, which incedently I have absolutely NO experience with...
I've used this in my office ever since it was robbed in Nov 2004:Derek wrote:Just off the top of my head, I am guessing that perhaps you are using web cams already attached to computers to look for movement and then use their modems/internet connection to contact the authorities, very simple indeed and wouldn't take a lot of programming. Just take a snapshot every couple of seconds and look for any major changes.
I could of course be a mile off.
http://www.deskshare.com/wcm.aspx
It takes snaps and video then FTPs them to an offsite server. I even have it email my cell phone so I know if anyone has set it off.
But the copyrigh dont cover the idea, just your code.Baldrick wrote: As for the patent idea, the solicitor I have already spoken to is a patent lawyer & he has advised that I would be better off using copyright with a good marketing plan.
A Patent covers the idea, not just YOUR code but anyone elses code about that idea.