Steve Jobs, Dead.

[utopiomania]

Apple is to me the worst of american business culture. Quicktime says it all. If it weren't for
these suckers, our old CD players would have a 'REC' button, like old cassette equipment.

But nooo, instead american film and music industry ruined the fun, and see where it got them..

Illegal downloads. Apple is as dead as the dead rat that is lying outside my house with its
tiny legs in the air right now.

[MachineCode]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/10...unlock_patent/

Dead link. What's the correct one?

[c4s]

Using marvelous S.E.T. (Search Engine Technology®) I found this:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/10/25 ... ck_patent/

[Kuron]

Apple is to me the worst of american business culture. Quicktime says it all. If it weren't for
these suckers, our old CD players would have a 'REC' button, like old cassette equipment.

But nooo, instead american film and music industry ruined the fun, and see where it got them..

Illegal downloads. Apple is as dead as the dead rat that is lying outside my house with its
tiny legs in the air right now.

CD players don't have a "REC" button on them because they are CD players not CD recorders. I own several CD recorders (commercial and consumer grade) all have a "REC" button on them.

Apple doesn't make CD players. Apple doesn't have anything to do with federal/international copyright laws.

Quicktime is pretty bad, but so is Windows' Media Player. Luckily there are legitimate third-party solutions to both.

[utopiomania]

The suckers are the worst of american business culture, like american film/music industry.

CD audio was designed to be able to record AUDIO as well, just like the cassette format, but they killed it because of the suckers mentioned above. CD was meant to be able to record, as well as play back audio.

A few years back you could buy CDs with music AND video as well. Put it in your PC, and you could watch music videos, in your car, play the music.

Anyways, Steve Jobs saved Apple, but now that he is gone, Microsoft will probably be the boss soon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6cNdhOKwi0

[Kuron]

CD audio was designed to be able to record AUDIO as well, just like the cassette format, but they killed it because of the suckers mentioned above. CD was meant to be able to record, as well as play back audio.

Odd, I have many CD recorders. Does Norway have some weird embargo or laws against selling CD recorders?

A few years back you could buy CDs with music AND video as well. Put it in your PC, and you could watch music videos, in your car, play the music.

You still can. I bought a new one two weeks ago.

[Zach]

You're not making any sense..

CD players with a record function wouldn't have done anything for consumers using CD's back when they were really big (the 90's). Assuming the hardware supporting it could be cheap enough to sell to consumers, much less the media itself; it took years and years for prices of recordable media to drop to truly affordable levels, and it took even still more years for quality error-free media to become common at the specifications consumers were demanding.

Most affordable consumer CD playing Boomboxes/Stereos did not come with audio output jacks half the time, what do you think input jacks and associated circuitry would have added to the cost? And what would you record... a song off the radio? meh. How much do you think such a portable system would have cost from Sony, etc?

I still do not see recordable CD Players for sale en masse in stores. There is not and never was a potential mass market for them, imho. Especially since the advent of affordable CD Burners for computers.

And finally. I don't see what Quicktime / Apple / etc have to do with any of it. Quicktime formats are digital storage formats, not playback platforms. I've purchased CD's that contained music and video (and picture!) content since it was first introduced back in the 90's as well.

Many popular bands have used this distribution platform to provide additional content on their CD's.

[utopiomania]

CD surfaced in the early 80s, CD recorders in 98, because of american copyright laws.

I didn't know you could still buy CD's with both video/music on them. That is cool

[Zach]

CD surfaced in the early 80s, CD recorders in 98, because of american copyright laws.

What is your basis for this assertion?

The AHRA (Audio Home Recording Act) of 1992, specifically protects consumers from being sued for infringing activities, relating to both Analog and Digital recording, for non-commercial use.

The AHRA's definition of "digital audio recording device" includes explicit exceptions for devices that are used primarily to record non-musical sounds (such as dictation devices and answering machines) and for "professional equipment". [10] The definition of professional equipment was to have been set by the Department of Commerce, though these regulations have never been issued. "Professional" minidisc recorders without SCMS cost thousands of dollars.

The AHRA's definition of "digital audio recording media" explicitly excludes pre-recorded but recordable media, and storage media used primarily to store information other than musical works.[11]

This exception was crucial in RIAA v. Diamond Multimedia Systems, Inc.,[12] the only case in which the AHRA's provisions have been examined by the federal courts. The RIAA filed suit to enjoin the manufacture and distribution of the Rio PMP300, one of the first portable MP3 players, because it did not include the SCMS copy protection required by the act, and Diamond did not intend to pay royalties. The 9th Circuit, affirming the earlier District Court ruling in favor of Diamond Multimedia,[13] ruled that the "digital music recording" for the purposes of the act was not intended to include songs fixed on computer hard drives. The court also held that the Rio was not a digital audio recording device for the purposes of the AHRA, because 1) the Rio reproduced files from computer hard drives, which were specifically exempted from the SCMS and Royalty payments under the act, 2) could not directly record from the radio or other transmissions.

Exemption from infringement actions
The AHRA contains one positive provision for the consumer electronics industry and consumers, section 1008, a "Prohibition on certain infringement actions:"

"No action may be brought under this title alleging infringement of copyright based on the manufacture, importation, or distribution of a digital audio recording device, a digital audio recording medium, an analog recording device, or an analog recording medium, or based on the noncommercial use by a consumer of such a device or medium for making digital musical recordings or analog musical recordings."[17]

According to the Senate, this provision was intended to conclusively resolve the debate over audio home taping, and "[create] an atmosphere of certainty to pave the way for the development and availability of new digital recording technologies and new musical recordings."[17] They were partially successful: this provision made the sale of DAT and Minidisc possible in the United States, by protecting device manufacturers, importers and distributors from infringement suits like Cahn v. Sony.

Private, noncommercial copies by consumers using "digital audio recording devices" are explicitly protected by §1008. The Senate report defines noncommercial as "not for direct or indirect commercial advantage", offering examples such as making copies for a family member, or copies for use in a car or portable tape player. [17]

If copyright law was the exclusive domain of the problem of a CD Recorder market, then the market should have popped up overnight during late 1992 or early 1993.

[GWarner]

CD surfaced in the early 80s, CD recorders in 98

CD recorders were available before then, they were just expensive. In 96 the place I worked for at the time bought one for about $600. In 98 a friend gave me one that cost aobut $300. By 2000, they were under $100.

[utopiomania]

Ok, but CD was supposed to replaces cassettes. They where everywhere, if you heard a nice
song on the radio, press 'rec' and play it in your car later, at home or on saturday night at a party

That simplicity is gone. Nowadays, everything needs to boot up, then freezes or is a general pain
in the ass to use.

I don't like Apple, but at least Steve Jobs hired the right industrial designer to make his i**
products a bit better than the competition in this respect.

More like cassettes and VHS

[Kuron]

CD surfaced in the early 80s, CD recorders in 98, because of american copyright laws.

I didn't know you could still buy CD's with both video/music on them. That is cool

Apple does not set or create American copyright laws and the laws had nothing to do with the lack of recorders.

[Kuron]

Ok, but CD was supposed to replaces cassettes.

CDs were supposed to (and did) replace LPs. Apple had nothing to do with either.

They where everywhere, if you heard a nice
song on the radio, press 'rec' and play it in your car later, at home or on saturday night at a party

You still can. Cassette players and recorders are in abundance and still widely made.

In the 90s, the MiniDisc was brought out to replace cassettes, but it never caught on in the consumer market here in the USA (in Japan, the MiniDisc was widely accepted by the consumer market). In the professional market (radio production), it was and (still is) used a lot. Back in the 90s, for music production there were many models of MD based multitrack recorders released along with mastering decks that were widely used by folks. Now, it is worthless for music production.


Apple had nothing to do with any of this.

That simplicity is gone. Nowadays, everything needs to boot up, then freezes or is a general pain
in the ass to use.

I still use CD players to listen to my music. The only difference is now most CD players (portable, rack, console and in-dash car models) can play MP3 CDs so I can stuff more music on a CD. I also listen to old time radio shows and audiobooks, talk shows on MP3 CDs. The only time I use a non-CD MP3 player is when I go out walking.

[utopiomania]

Apple had nothing to do with any of this.

Of course, Apple is protected by American patent and coyright laws, designed to
protect American companies and capital investments, not us ordinary people.

And, Apple use these laws to sue everyone, my cat included, so I hope they die and
crumble like the wicked witch from the east..

In the meantime, I have gone cassette in my e-car, bought a Nakamichi 480Z mint
condition cassette deck, a DJ style LP direct-drive turntable with a Shure broadcast pickup,
a Panasonic 330W boomblaster, a Sony cassette walkman, and some other stuff.

To hell with copy-protection and big ugly companies like Apple and their iTunes virus.

[Zach]

Have fun with that inferior cassette playback quality and degradation after each use.