Between the devil and the deep blue sea

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:43 pm

Nik wrote:[..]the marketing Ubuntu does helps the Linux community as a whole[..]

Helps the Linux community? Last week 4 ex-Ubuntu users turned to the side of Gentoo because they had endless problems with Ubuntu and they didn't know even how to copy files using cp and they said they were "very experienced" with Ubuntu.. Experienced with what? Clicking on some menu items and buttons doesn't mean you are experienced. Ubuntu should focus also on teaching the user to take everything to the MAX by giving simple and detailed guides on how to use command-line utilities.

I hate Ubuntu because it wants to be 1) "THE" GNU/Linux and 2) "FREE" Mac OS X (in contrast to their goals to make the user do everything with clicking). And Ubuntu has never given credit back to the Debian project. http://www.ubuntu.com/ says: "Ubuntu is a community developed, linux-based operating system"; shouldn't instead of "linux-based" be "Debian GNU/Linux derived" or something else????

Kale · Post by **Kale** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:13 pm

codemaniac wrote:I hate Ubuntu

You're in the minority of Linux users.

Ubuntu is fantastic. I don't really care if debian is 'easier' to use than Ubuntu, i just can't think of how much easier it can be, to click a few times and get things done. If i'm stuck, i consult the extremely good documentation on the Ubuntu site. Everything seems to be covered nicely. Another good thing about Ubuntu is the look and feel of the OS. It just looks cool and friendly, in nice soothing browns, etc... it's probably the only OS i've ever used where i've left all the default settings as they are because they're spot on.

I'll admit, Ubuntu isn't there yet, but in a year or two, Microsoft will be up for some stiff competition. Mark this post for future reference.

Dare · Post by **Dare** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:51 am

Such unity ....

Anyone tried ReactOS in a serious way?

god64 · Post by **god64** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:53 am

codemaniac wrote:
god64 wrote:what are you trying to proof?
That Debian is exactly as easy to use as Ubuntu.

which is a widely known fact. As ubuntu states clearly on their homepage themself: The Server Edition - built on the solid foundation of Debian which is known for its robust server installations

If Debian would also be advertized everywhere and have such a big hype, you would be saying Debian is the EASIEST distro.

no, because it uses old software versions and refuses to include non-free software, you'll have to fiddle with a text editor in /etc/apt to fix this . i did not install debian recently, but it must have changed a lot, if the install process is as noob compatible as ubuntu's is. (getting a bunch of new servers next week, than i'll check and ill kick debian out if they do also use a graphical installer for dummies now)

Feisty and Gutsy keep crashing on my PC, Dapper works OK... Is that EASY for a newbie to understand that they need an older version of Ubuntu?

you did understand what a distribution is? its a collection of the linux kernel, some software having nothing to do with the distribution and a installer + default configs. if it crashes, which it NEVER did for me, it's not a distribution specific thing, its some problem of some software and/or kernel version. but as you seem to be the only one out there where it keeps crashing, maybe ubuntu is only too hard to use

Trond · Post by **Trond** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:43 am

god64 wrote:
Feisty and Gutsy keep crashing on my PC, Dapper works OK... Is that EASY for a newbie to understand that they need an older version of Ubuntu?
you did understand what a distribution is? its a collection of the linux kernel, some software having nothing to do with the distribution and a installer + default configs. if it crashes, which it NEVER did for me, it's not a distribution specific thing, its some problem of some software and/or kernel version. but as you seem to be the only one out there where it keeps crashing, maybe ubuntu is only too hard to use

Feisty freezes when I activate my "supported" wireless card. That does not happen with any other linux distro.

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:21 am

Trond wrote:
god64 wrote:
Feisty and Gutsy keep crashing on my PC, Dapper works OK... Is that EASY for a newbie to understand that they need an older version of Ubuntu?
you did understand what a distribution is? its a collection of the linux kernel, some software having nothing to do with the distribution and a installer + default configs. if it crashes, which it NEVER did for me, it's not a distribution specific thing, its some problem of some software and/or kernel version. but as you seem to be the only one out there where it keeps crashing, maybe ubuntu is only too hard to use
Feisty freezes when I activate my "supported" wireless card. That does not happen with any other linux distro.

Good that I'm not the only one with problems with recent Ubuntu versions.

@god64: What are you trying to achieve? You are like trying to convince and absurdist to believe there is a God.. That just doesn't work. It seems that you find Ubuntu sucks too because then you wouldn't have taken the time to reply to my negative Ubuntu posts

Also, the problem with Feisty and Gutsy are their kernels which don't have support for my hardware. Both of them freeze on boot and then reboot..

I think it is more important to have a rock solid system even if you have to use some older packages, because if you go to the Ubuntu Community you will see that there are way too many threads about problems with someone's hardware/software because a newer package pulled in new bugs.

Nik · Post by **Nik** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:36 am

Than what the hell is your problem with staying with Debian, why do you have to hate Ubuntu if you don't need to use it.
The only operating system one can hate is Windows because getting around it for example in school or at work is pretty impossible but what the heck keeps you from using Debian and being happy with it?

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:40 am

Nik wrote:Than what the hell is your problem with staying with Debian, [..]but what the heck keeps you from using Debian and being happy with it?

The hype. The only thing I hate about Ubuntu is the big hype and now because Dell sells Ubuntu on their systems too, some people even on the Debian forums say "Ubuntu is the greatest because even Dell uses it".

Wherever Linux related websites I go, there is atleast one mention of Ubuntu and that's what makes me sick about it. It's true that I have been using Ubuntu for a year before I moved on to Gentoo, and that's why I can freely as an experienced ex-Ubuntu user say that it simply sucks.

End of the discussion.

PB · Post by PB » Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:04 pm

> Kale and PB and all other Ubuntu people
[...]
> n00bs like Kale or PB have proprietary codecs pre-installed

Are you referring to me above? Because I don't know what you're talking
about. I don't use Linux at all. I tested Ubuntu once but it wouldn't let me
install it on a blank partition on my HD so I thought "stuff this" and didn't
bother since. It's that sort of un-userfriendliness that stops people going
from Windows to Linux. Well, it stopped me, and how many others have
had such an experience and also thought "stuff it"? I mean, what's just
so freaking hard about telling Ubuntu: "there's a 13 GB empty partition,
go there!" and it refuses? Fine, I'll stick with Windows then. :roll:

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:35 pm

PB wrote:> Kale and PB and all other Ubuntu people
[...]
> n00bs like Kale or PB have proprietary codecs pre-installed

Are you referring to me above?

Sorry, I didn't want to refer to you. It was a mistake

Kale · Post by **Kale** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:50 pm

codemaniac wrote:
Nik wrote:Than what the hell is your problem with staying with Debian, [..]but what the heck keeps you from using Debian and being happy with it?
The hype. The only thing I hate about Ubuntu is the big hype and now because Dell sells Ubuntu on their systems too, some people even on the Debian forums say "Ubuntu is the greatest because even Dell uses it".

Frankly it's about time the Linux community distilled to a single distro. A distro such as Ubuntu that has a goal and a view of the future. Ubuntu is making waves because somebody decided enough was enough with all the chaff out there and decided to create a distro that would eventually challenge MS.

http://www.informationweek.com/blog/mai ... linux.html

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 8:48 pm

Kale wrote:Frankly it's about time the Linux community distilled to a single distro. A distro such as Ubuntu that has a goal and a view of the future. Ubuntu is making waves because somebody decided enough was enough with all the chaff out there and decided to create a distro that would eventually challenge MS.

http://www.informationweek.com/blog/mai ... linux.html

Ok, you won Kale. Next time I'll kick you in the ass though

And don't expect me to pay for your beers, or otherwise I'll get bankrupt

BackToReality()

Alexander Wolfe opened a new view of Ubuntu for me.. Maybe I should support Ubuntu till we kill da MicroN00bs

chen · Post by **chen** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 9:23 pm

Near 1 year ago I decided to go the Linux way, I tested several distros, at the
end Ubuntu was the best. I started with Ubuntu 6.10 and move to Ubuntu
7.04, no problem at all. Im running it in a Notebook Compaq Presario V2000, at
leat 2 years old...

Everything runs, hardware and installed software, the only software I miss is
a decent web builder to say windows: "see you in hell"

Kale · Post by **Kale** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 9:45 pm

codemaniac wrote:Next time I'll kick you in the ass though

Many people have tried and failed.

codemaniac · Post by **codemaniac** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:00 pm

Kale wrote:
codemaniac wrote:Next time I'll kick you in the ass though
Many people have tried and failed.

Can't you just shut up

Nah kidding, please do say what you like of my music piece: http://www.purebasic.fr/english/viewtopic.php?t=28085