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9 November 2011 - Adobe announces to stop development for flash player on mobile.
So Apple has won the flashplayer battle on mobile and this could mean that eventually
flash content will disappear also on the desktop. Just too bad for all those people who
invested in as2 and as3 and that includes me. Html 5 and javascript are still at least
10 years behind of Flash and they will never make it look as good as Flash can do.
I already started to study jquery to catch up - but hey it's called evolution right ?
news flash
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/perlow/exclus ... tml5/19226

Have a look here and see why html 5 and javascript are still way behind flash
http://else.bz or here http://else.bz/#/Touch/ThesPlay

Before some of you start bashing on flash eyecandy and that it is unnecessary,
why then is the ProGUI lib so popular ?
cw

I agree that Flash still does some stuff that can't be achieved with HTML5, at least not as easily, but really, HTML5 is the winner IMHO. It is easier, it's more flexible, it is developed and improved constantly, and it's native to the browser. Flash was very useful for a long time, but that time is over. HTML5 is the future, and its capabilities will surpass those of Flash very soon.

The majority of flash content on the internet is used to play media files or to show simple advertisements.
For those purposes, html5 works well enough.

codewalker wrote:this could mean that eventually
flash content will disappear also on the desktop.

This would be a dream come true for the industry and users! Imagine one of the biggest security exploits for desktop operating systems and one of the biggest contributors to system crashes, is removed for good and never allowed on any system. Imagine companies no longer losing millions of dollars in lost production because of systems that have been crippled and brought down by exploits in Flash that exist solely because of Adobe's gross incompetence.

codewalker wrote:Adobe announces to stop development for flash player on mobile.
So Apple has won the flashplayer battle...

It is not an Apple issue, it is a mobile issue. A mobile platform is much more limited compared to a traditional desktop platform. Space (ie, size) and performance are crucial factors for mobile development. Native apps will always be the best choice. Apple was the only company who had the balls to stand up to the neighborhood bully and tell them we are not going to tolerate your crap: we will stand up for our users and we will not allow you to compromise the security and integrity of their mobile devices.

codewalker wrote: why then is the ProGUI lib so popular ?
cw

Because it doesn't use flash? There is nothing wrong with something being attractive. What is unacceptable and inexcusable is when that attractive thing uses a bloated, buggy and vulnerable method to provide that attractiveness. The phrase it is like putting lipstick on a pig comes to mind.

Adobe ceases development on mobile browser Flash, refocuses efforts on HTML5

So, now they want to work on destroying HTML5.

Kuron wrote:Apple was the only company who had the balls to stand up to the neighborhood bully and tell them we are not going to tolerate your crap: we will stand up for our users and we will not allow you to compromise the security and integrity of their mobile devices.

They're standing up for their users by denying them a choice?

Honestly, I think only an Apple user would view the world like that.

the.weavster wrote:They're standing up for their users by denying them a choice?

I am not aware of any user who would choose to install known malware on their system.

I wish MS could legally stand up for their users. A large percentage of the security issues with Windows lately has been exploits in Flash and Adobe Reader. I applaud Microsoft for literally destroying Adobe Reader in Windows 8 by providing native support for PDFs. Now, if they could just find a way they could legally block Flash, the Windows world would be a safer place.

the.weavster wrote:Honestly, I think only an Apple user would view the world like that.

Unless you have a service that cleans infected systems, I am not sure why you would want somebody to knowingly compromise the integrity of their system.


Flash quit being relevant and reputable once Adobe bought Macromedia. In just six years, Adobe has managed to make Flash the single biggest laughingstock and embarrassment of the industry.

So I guess this means the evenutal downfall of YouTube since all their content uses flash. Good Jobs, Apple, after all, you did say you would drestroy Google.

And I guess nobody cares about all the indie game developers that used Flash to write they're games, a whole market has now been deenied to therm. Isn't that akin to denial of trade? Which last time I checked was illegal. I wonder how many of the people in that industry will lose their jobs because of this?

So what does this mean, ultimately it sets a precident that allows for shutting down anything that might be a security risk. And people complain that we are slowly becoming a police state. Sounds to me like we are practically already there.

The only people that have won this battle are the lawyers, win or lose they still collect their fees.

YouTube works fine on iOS using html5.

Adobe will focus on native apps that can be created with ActionScript.
So it's not that you can't create ActionScript based games anymore but you will have to distribute them differently.
It is of course a problem for developers using third party tools for development.

GWarner wrote:I guess this means the evenutal downfall of YouTube since all their content uses flash.

This is incorrect.

GWarner wrote:a whole market has now been deenied to therm.

No it hasn't.

GWarner wrote:Isn't that akin to denial of trade?

LOL, should we be upset because developers can no longer find a market for their software targeting CP/M or DOS?

GWarner wrote:I wonder how many of the people in that industry will lose their jobs because of this?

Zero, in fact more jobs have been created. Some indie developers have actually had to hire on more developers and form small companies because their business has grown. Flash has died for a reason. Most legitimate indie game developers who were using flash for browser-based games, have moved into mobile game development which is where the money currently is if you are an indie developer. You literally can't give away PC games anymore.

I couldnt care less about Flash and Adobe, but i dont know why Apple is making a big fuss either. If they want to sandbox/virtualize their browser for security reasons, then they should just do it. Whats the point of Apple's hate against Flash? If it is about a plug-in opening up security holes, then Apple needs to fix this and not target a single company/product. Or why are people cheering for Apple going against flash when the next 20 plug-ins by other companies open up the very same security risks, it's just not as widely known because they arent as popular as Flash is/was?

In this thread it sounds like Apple forbids non-native development plug-ins, but thats not true. Unity-3d and others are doing quite well on Apple iphone or ipad's. It is not about "non-native" or "interpreted" in general. Thats what apple initially made it sound like, but it seems they only "enforce" this with Flash.

This really seems a bit like march 2010 again, which is especially silly as:

a) smartphones get more powerfull and energy efficient each year, so the performance cost is hardly an argument

b) the same performance (and energy) problem happens with native apps too and actually Apple already has policies about that, why not just apply them to "non native stuff" too?

c) well written non-native apps can require less power than badly written native apps

d) why doesnt apple just sandbox/virtualize the flash plug-in then? They have a finetuned policy system which will soon by enforced on ALL Mac OS X software, why dont they just use that on plug-ins?

I just think the way apple goes against Adobe is weird. While i dont like Adobe and couldnt care less about Flash, it makes me worry if Apple succeeds against a large company like this....

Not a good sign for anybody wanting to make business on the Apple platform IMHO.

Kuron wrote:Most legitimate indie game developers who were using flash for browser-based games, have moved into mobile game development which is where the money currently is if you are an indie developer. You literally can't give away PC games anymore.

Browser based games are a huge market and i guess part of the reason is because PC's at work can run them without requiring a game installation.

This is all about Apples backing of HTML5, nothing more, nothing less.

They want complete and total control of what runs on their systems, and if you don't play by their rules, they will destroy you.

I think its very telling that YouTube went with an HTML5 trial and almost immediately reverted back to Flash.

I couldn't figure out why Youtube looked different at first, for that short time, before going back to "normal" until I came across the story.

If you look at the Adobe site, you see they released 13 security updates of Flash Player in one year.
For a desktop OS like Windows or OS X, this isn't a real problem but how do you envision that for an os like iOS.
iOS apps run on their own with limited access to anything outside the app. So supporting Flash more or less means embedding it in iOS directly.
Any idea how many complaints there would be if you would have to update iOS a dozen times a year ?

Or they could simply..... tell adobe to go redesign Flash to work on their iOS, or shut up ?

It is of course a problem for developers using third party tools for development.

I don't think it will be a major issue. Most new third-party tools simply export the action script so it can be "compiled" with Adobe's "compiler".

Zach wrote:Or they could simply..... tell adobe to go redesign Flash to work on their iOS, or shut up ?

They did and Adobe didn't like it, whined about it, and was incapable of doing it, which lead to the announcement in the first post.

It is a win-win for everybody. Adobe has finally been forced to invest money into R&D and will be producing a competitive API instead of one based on 16 year old technology. Users will get a new, more secure and better performing API that developers can use to produce software for them. Adobe might be able to regain market share they have lost while they sat on their butts and refused to do anything while technology passed them by. Keyword "might". Personally, I think Adobe has caused themselves irreversible damage by refusing to invest in innovation for so many years. Many of the major players seem to have given up on Adobe because of their indifference and incompetence and are working to embrace and establish new standards, many of which are "open".

I know what you mean with a win-win situation for us all, but this situation made several developers in the Unity-3d community *shit scared* that Adobe will buy Unity and drive the product into the ground just like they did with others