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Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:33 pm
by LCD
I like all the features...
Except:
Fred wrote:
Code: Select all
- Removed: PowerPC version for OS X
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:34 pm
by Kuron
Bisonte wrote:
hmmmm,
Release Date of DirectX 9.0 was December 19, 2002 !
PB is multi-platform. As popular as OS X and Linux are, some of us still have to support Windows. XP users still constitute a huge percentage of Windows users and we have to support XP users. It is career suicide not to. Many of the graphics chips and cards on older XP systems are not capable of DirectX9, but will still handle DirectX7 fine. Intentionally crippling PureBasic in this way is not a wise choice and it hurts nothing to leave the DirectX7 compatibility in.
As you point out, DirectX 9 is grossly outdated and has been for a long time. There needs to be a DirectX 11 subsystem implemented ASAP, for people who want to target Windows 7 and 8 only.
Bisonte wrote:10 years after... ok, longer than MS supported their most OS's ...
XP is still being supported until 2014.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:09 pm
by Fred
You can still download PB 5.00 if you need DirectX7 & OS X PPC support (on windows there is also the OpenGL subsystem which can run on older OS). It's not like they won't run anymore tomorrow. Both are more than outdated, we can't support these forever and we choose to spend our time on new features than obsolete things.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 5:07 pm
by PMV
Kuron wrote:PB is multi-platform. As popular as OS X and Linux are, some of us still have to support Windows. XP users still constitute a huge percentage of Windows users and we have to support XP users. It is career suicide not to. Many of the graphics chips and cards on older XP systems are not capable of DirectX9, but will still handle DirectX7 fine. Intentionally crippling PureBasic in this way is not a wise choice and it hurts nothing to leave the DirectX7 compatibility in.
Graphic chips that old are to slow for real gaming. Someone
who wants to play games needs to have the hardware that is
supported. 95% of available games use DX9 and newer, older
DX is still supported by DX9. Graphic-cards already that old are
replaced by new models to play newer games. DirectX7 is outdated
since many years. If your PC is that old, that it can't run DX9, you
doesn't want to play games. Game-PCs even that old are to slow
for current games. The 3 or 4 people who doesn't want to upgrade
there PC ... as a game developer you doesn't have any benefit
from that people.
As you point out, DirectX 9 is grossly outdated and has been for a long time. There needs to be a DirectX 11 subsystem implemented ASAP, for people who want to target Windows 7 and 8 only.
DX9 is not outdated. It is still supported by current hardware ...
as long as that is the case there is no need to update. The
Sprite-Library doesn't have any benefit from that ... only
OGRE3D would be nice to have that with DX10 and DX11
to be able to use all possible features of current hardware.
XP is still being supported until 2014.
Only SP3 but that has nothing to do with DirectX.
MFG PMV
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 5:08 pm
by DoctorLove
Fred wrote:You can still download PB 5.00 if you need DirectX7 & OS X PPC support (on windows there is also the OpenGL subsystem which can run on older OS). It's not like they won't run anymore tomorrow. Both are more than outdated, we can't support these forever and we choose to spend our time on new features than obsolete things.
1000% Agree!
More features = Me more happy
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:31 pm
by Rescator
If Windows 2000 has DirectX 7 drivers and hardware then DirectX 9 (9.0c ?) can be installed/can work with it (DX9 need minimum DX7 HW/Drivers, DX8 need minimum DX6 HW/drivers).
The following installer might work on Windows 2000
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download ... aspx?id=35 (MS has removed references to 2000, XP, XP SP1 etc in texts.)
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:47 pm
by dige
Great release
Thanks Fred and the Team!
but .. "disallow native type for pointers" .. brings me a lot of work
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:29 pm
by Blankname
Kuron wrote:
- Removed: DirectX7 and NT4 subsystem on Windows
Very bizarre to remove DX7 when may low end GPU chips will not properly support DX9, but will still support DX7 very well. You have just introduced massive compatibility issues for PB users by doing this.
If you use any Windows OS below XP/2003. Then you seriously need to buy a new computer.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:26 am
by Josh
First of all, a really great release. Thanks to Fred and all others.
Fred wrote:- Added: Define now behave like Global and accept Dim(), NewMap() and NewList() on the same line
I like the idea to create arrays, lists and maps with Define. But I think, the instructions could be still more logical.
We pass an array to a procedure with
Array
We create an array in a structure with
Array
We get the size of an array with
ArraySize
We free an array with
FreeArray
But, we create an Array with
Dim
I think it would more consistently to use:
Code: Select all
Define Array a(2), List b.i(), Map c.i()
instead of
Code: Select all
Define Dim a(2), NewList b.i(), NewMap c.i()
To have not to much changes on existing codes, the usage of Dim, NewList, NewMap outside of Define, Protected, Static and Global should be allowed furthermore.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:55 am
by skywalk
dige wrote:Great release
Thanks Fred and the Team!
but .. "disallow native type for pointers" .. brings me a lot of work
Yes, this was a pain for me too, but I changed my C header converter from *pointer.nativetype to *pointer_nativetype. So really, not as bad as I initially thought.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:42 am
by MachineCode
Kuron wrote:There needs to be a DirectX 11 subsystem implemented ASAP, for people who want to target Windows 7 and 8 only.
I don't code games so I have no idea, but it appears to me that subsystems are a way of providing support for both DX9 and DX11? And the PureBasic programmer can select whichever subsystem they wish to compile for? Would that not work? (Talking to Fred/Freak here).
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:03 pm
by applePi
Thank you , a Great (( PureBasic apocalypse day Edition )).
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:23 pm
by Kuron
Graphic chips that old are to slow for real gaming.
This is false.
95% of available games use DX9 and newer
This is false. You are confusing indie games with major titles.
Game-PCs even that old are to slow
for current games. The 3 or 4 people who doesn't want to upgrade
there PC ... as a game developer you doesn't have any benefit
from that people.
The systems are not too slow for games, and the casual demographic is the largest demographic, and most profitable demographic, for games for indie game developers.
If you use any Windows OS below XP/2003. Then you seriously need to buy a new computer.
Like it or not, XP is still in wide use by EUs. Given the utter abortion Windows 8 turned out to be, people aren't going to be leaving 7 any time soon and many will be holding onto XP until a fitting successor comes out for Windows 7
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:34 pm
by Kuron
Fred wrote: (on windows there is also the OpenGL subsystem which can run on older OS).
I already decided to just use the OpenGL subsystem. OpenGL is far more compatible on Windows and cheapo graphics cards/chips than what DirectX is. Anything new will be written in another language, but I still have two more WIP things in PB to push out before I make the switch over.
All in all, good update, other than DX7 and JCALG1 being removed. I will throw the latter in a DLL and keep using it, so it is not a big deal.
Re: PureBasic 5.10 - Granted wishes release - is out !
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:43 pm
by Golfy
Great announce, very happy to see a lot of important new commands : however, don't know how to use some of them because they aren't in local help file (ie. MemoryStatus(x))
Is there a way to have an help file updated ?
Thanks a lot to all the team !