Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by Muadib.
I dunno wayne1.
They're too programmed to hate the US. I heard that same diatribe about "invasion" on news casts about protesters in Jordan. Spouting some nonsense about how the US wants to take over Iraq, and take it's oil. He's just mindlessly repeating what he hears, and is not think for himself.
As CoderLaureate says, "Think for yourselves people.". Look at the big picture. Innocent people have died. Innocent people will die. Innocent people die. Innocent people die by natural causes, and innocent people die for totaly unfair reasons. Sometimes innocent people die in their sleep, and sometimes they die in terror and agony. Ask the 3,000 plus victims that died in the world trade center bombing.
I tell you I would rather die in terror than to live in terror.
And before you go off spouting something like "They're living in terror right now because of US bombs." I tell you they're not living in terror. They're living in uncertainy. That uncertainy is quickly becoming realization that the terror they've been living in is coming to an end.
Of course we have no right to decide who lives and who dies. By that same rational we have no way to control who lives and who dies. There is a greater good being served here. Say what you will about George Bush and the US. If he is a fool, he's a fool being used by a higer power to do good.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
Its time to stop Bush!!!
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by Muadib.
The majority of the people in Iraq are so jubilant today that they're beside themselves with joy. Heck they just toppled a statue of Saddam Hussein right in downtown Baghdad. I see a picture of an Iraqi child kissing a US soldier.
Your government, and the other small-minded people around you have programmed you into thinking we're there as killers to invade, rape and pillage. They're wrong.
If we wanted to take over Iraq, we wouldn't have sent in our foot soldiers so soon. We could have just bombed the hell out of Iraq, and then sent in foot solders to clean up the mess. Use your sense of logic. Before you go off saying "We're bombing them now." Of course we're bombing them now. These are strategic tacticle bombings. Sometimes (even with the advanced technology we poses) the bombs miss their targets.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
Before, during, and after bombing. Do you seriously think we purposely targeted civilian homes and blow them up for fun? I thought you were an intelligent person wcardoso. I guess I was wrong.Originally posted by wcardoso
waine1 wrote:
"From community to community, men yelled "I love you, I love" and handed out blue boxes of Iraqi cigarettes called Sumers."
Tell me waine1, all that people yell "I love you" before or after the american bombing their houses ?
The majority of the people in Iraq are so jubilant today that they're beside themselves with joy. Heck they just toppled a statue of Saddam Hussein right in downtown Baghdad. I see a picture of an Iraqi child kissing a US soldier.
Your government, and the other small-minded people around you have programmed you into thinking we're there as killers to invade, rape and pillage. They're wrong.
If we wanted to take over Iraq, we wouldn't have sent in our foot soldiers so soon. We could have just bombed the hell out of Iraq, and then sent in foot solders to clean up the mess. Use your sense of logic. Before you go off saying "We're bombing them now." Of course we're bombing them now. These are strategic tacticle bombings. Sometimes (even with the advanced technology we poses) the bombs miss their targets.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
in El Calon they most all have family in Iraq many of these people are going back to help run Iraq after the war, when you talk to them they understand that thier family may be accidently killed but also understand Saddam must go and this is the only way to end almost thirty years of his terror, how freakin many people do you think Saddam has killed, you should have applied for a job as his propaganda minister before it was too late because your better than any that he had (TIP: the PLO needs guys like you).
You saw them on TV I live close to a huge area of Iraqi-AmericansTell me waine1, all that people yell "I love you" before or after the american bombing their houses ?
I'd saw in TV a iraqui men crying because all their family was killed last night. Eleven members of their family, pregnant wife, sons, etc.
in El Calon they most all have family in Iraq many of these people are going back to help run Iraq after the war, when you talk to them they understand that thier family may be accidently killed but also understand Saddam must go and this is the only way to end almost thirty years of his terror, how freakin many people do you think Saddam has killed, you should have applied for a job as his propaganda minister before it was too late because your better than any that he had (TIP: the PLO needs guys like you).
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
Propaganda within Nazi Germany was taken to a new and frequently perverse level:
Hitler was very aware of the value of good propaganda and he appointed Joseph Goebbels as head of propaganda.
Propaganda is the art of persuasion - persuading others that your 'side of the story' is correct.
Nazi propaganda in 1940 about the invasion of Poland saids that polands needs to be 'liberated', just like movie documental:
Campaign In Poland (1940)
Nazi-produced propaganda film that seeks to justify the German invasion of Poland on the grounds that the Poles needed to be "liberated."
http://www.moviesunlimited.com/musite/f ... sku=651019
Its something like CNN today: Poor iraquies needs to be liberated!!
German people believes Hitler in 1940, US people believes George W Bush in 2003.
If somebody just see the US media, its obvious that they feel like US army are like angels that are providing goods, hope and liberation to iraq people.
No one else in the world believes that. Our media shows the dead people of an insane self-loving criminal that its not happy with murders, he loves to think that he is doing something nice!!!
Maybe is the anti-usa propaganda in our media... maybe its US media propaganda. But our propaganda dont push us to kill people, thats the difference.
I just know that nobody has the right to decide for others and kill people 'in the name of god', thats barbaric!!
US Government are identical to Bin Laden, both thinks that god is on his side and feel that they could kill in name of higher values.
Just a bunch of vulgar murders, no matter what NAZI propaganda says!!!
(In fact US are not anymore a free country, Bush can do whatever he want to people inside US because the liberties of dissent are gone!, he could even read the emails or investigate what books read any people or do whatever he want and nobody can judge him in the future. He call that 'Patriotic'... just like nazis again... Very very similar to Hitler speechs and actions.)
Heil Bush!!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
Propaganda within Nazi Germany was taken to a new and frequently perverse level:
Hitler was very aware of the value of good propaganda and he appointed Joseph Goebbels as head of propaganda.
Propaganda is the art of persuasion - persuading others that your 'side of the story' is correct.
Nazi propaganda in 1940 about the invasion of Poland saids that polands needs to be 'liberated', just like movie documental:
Campaign In Poland (1940)
Nazi-produced propaganda film that seeks to justify the German invasion of Poland on the grounds that the Poles needed to be "liberated."
http://www.moviesunlimited.com/musite/f ... sku=651019
Its something like CNN today: Poor iraquies needs to be liberated!!
German people believes Hitler in 1940, US people believes George W Bush in 2003.
If somebody just see the US media, its obvious that they feel like US army are like angels that are providing goods, hope and liberation to iraq people.
No one else in the world believes that. Our media shows the dead people of an insane self-loving criminal that its not happy with murders, he loves to think that he is doing something nice!!!
Maybe is the anti-usa propaganda in our media... maybe its US media propaganda. But our propaganda dont push us to kill people, thats the difference.
I just know that nobody has the right to decide for others and kill people 'in the name of god', thats barbaric!!
US Government are identical to Bin Laden, both thinks that god is on his side and feel that they could kill in name of higher values.
Just a bunch of vulgar murders, no matter what NAZI propaganda says!!!
(In fact US are not anymore a free country, Bush can do whatever he want to people inside US because the liberties of dissent are gone!, he could even read the emails or investigate what books read any people or do whatever he want and nobody can judge him in the future. He call that 'Patriotic'... just like nazis again... Very very similar to Hitler speechs and actions.)
Heil Bush!!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
Right, that scene in downtown Baghdad was done on a Hollywood studio lot, I should have known.Nazi-produced propaganda film that seeks to justify the German invasion of Poland on the grounds that the Poles needed to be "liberated."
It's not polite to bite the evil hand that feeds you.US Government are identical to Bin Laden, both thinks that god is on his side and feel that they could kill in name of higher values.
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
Did anybody remembers the Stalin promises about free elections in Poland?????
The name of the document was: "DECLARATION OF LIBERATED EUROPE" (sounds familiar the LIBERATED word? just read part of the document!!):
The establishment of order in Europe and the rebuilding of national
economic life must be achieved by processes which will enable the
liberated peoples to destroy the last vestiges of nazism and fascism
and to create democratic institutions of their own choice...
To foster the conditions in which the liberated people may exercise
these rights, the three governments will jointly assist the people in any
European liberated state or former Axis state in Europe where, in
their judgment conditions require,Â
(a) to establish conditions of internal peace;Â
(b) to carry out emergency relief measures for the relief of
distressed peoples;Â
(c) to form interim governmental authorities broadly
representative of all democratic elements in the population and
pledged to the earliest possible establishment through free
elections of Governments responsive to the will of the people;
andÂ
(d) to facilitate where necessary the holding of such elections...
By this declaration we reaffirm our faith in the principles of the
Atlantic Charter, our pledge in the Declaration by the United Nations
and our determination to build in cooperation with other peace-loving
nations world order, under law, dedicated to peace, security, freedom
and general well-being of all mankind.
http://isc.temple.edu/hist249/declarati ... urope_.htm
Does it sounds familiar?????????
People believes and celebrate this document!!!
Why are people believing one again on his givernement whan they say the same old story that NEVER comes true?
What does happenss with the 'liberation' of Haiti a few years ago?
Does people will never learn that governments just say words and words (peace, liberty, etc) to lie to the people?
DONT BELIEVE KILLER GOVERNMENTS!
*PS: Dont forget that the DECLARATION OF LIBERATED EUROPE was signed by URSS, US and UK!!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
Did anybody remembers the Stalin promises about free elections in Poland?????
The name of the document was: "DECLARATION OF LIBERATED EUROPE" (sounds familiar the LIBERATED word? just read part of the document!!):
The establishment of order in Europe and the rebuilding of national
economic life must be achieved by processes which will enable the
liberated peoples to destroy the last vestiges of nazism and fascism
and to create democratic institutions of their own choice...
To foster the conditions in which the liberated people may exercise
these rights, the three governments will jointly assist the people in any
European liberated state or former Axis state in Europe where, in
their judgment conditions require,Â
(a) to establish conditions of internal peace;Â
(b) to carry out emergency relief measures for the relief of
distressed peoples;Â
(c) to form interim governmental authorities broadly
representative of all democratic elements in the population and
pledged to the earliest possible establishment through free
elections of Governments responsive to the will of the people;
andÂ
(d) to facilitate where necessary the holding of such elections...
By this declaration we reaffirm our faith in the principles of the
Atlantic Charter, our pledge in the Declaration by the United Nations
and our determination to build in cooperation with other peace-loving
nations world order, under law, dedicated to peace, security, freedom
and general well-being of all mankind.
http://isc.temple.edu/hist249/declarati ... urope_.htm
Does it sounds familiar?????????
People believes and celebrate this document!!!
Why are people believing one again on his givernement whan they say the same old story that NEVER comes true?
What does happenss with the 'liberation' of Haiti a few years ago?
Does people will never learn that governments just say words and words (peace, liberty, etc) to lie to the people?
DONT BELIEVE KILLER GOVERNMENTS!
*PS: Dont forget that the DECLARATION OF LIBERATED EUROPE was signed by URSS, US and UK!!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
This is real life, not rambo.
US is just one more nation.
First liberate the millions and millions of people slaves of drugs inside US (like George and Jeb daughters)and then talk about liberate the world.
Too much Spiderman is not good!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
You should know that they just show you a part of the story.Right, that scene in downtown Baghdad was done on a Hollywood studio lot, I should have known.
Dont make my laugh.It's not polite to bite the evil hand that feeds you.
This is real life, not rambo.
US is just one more nation.
First liberate the millions and millions of people slaves of drugs inside US (like George and Jeb daughters)and then talk about liberate the world.
Too much Spiderman is not good!
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
The alliances between the United States, the Soviet Union, and Britain unraveled in the years after World War II. The Soviet Union and the United States emerged from World War II with very different goals. Soviet leaders wanted to secure their borders and spread communism, while the United States wanted to promote free trade and democracy.At the Yalta Conference, the Big Three agreed that Europeans should choose their own governments and that Germany should be divided into four zones. However, Soviet-American relations deteriorated when Stalin demanded heavy German reparations for war damages. At the Potsdam Conference, it became apparent that the United States and the Soviet Union had very different visions of post-war Germany. The Soviets refused to make further commitments to upholding the Declaration of Liberated Europe, and Stalin never fulfilled his promise to allow free elections in Soviet-occupied countries. As the countries of Eastern Europe fell under the influence of communism, an iron curtain separated Eastern Europe from the West.
So What?*PS: Dont forget that the DECLARATION OF LIBERATED EUROPE was signed by URSS, US and UK!!
The alliances between the United States, the Soviet Union, and Britain unraveled in the years after World War II. The Soviet Union and the United States emerged from World War II with very different goals. Soviet leaders wanted to secure their borders and spread communism, while the United States wanted to promote free trade and democracy.At the Yalta Conference, the Big Three agreed that Europeans should choose their own governments and that Germany should be divided into four zones. However, Soviet-American relations deteriorated when Stalin demanded heavy German reparations for war damages. At the Potsdam Conference, it became apparent that the United States and the Soviet Union had very different visions of post-war Germany. The Soviets refused to make further commitments to upholding the Declaration of Liberated Europe, and Stalin never fulfilled his promise to allow free elections in Soviet-occupied countries. As the countries of Eastern Europe fell under the influence of communism, an iron curtain separated Eastern Europe from the West.
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
You continually mention him.
Take a reality check.
Wow, I'm a star.You should know that they just show you a part of the story.
I'm concerned for you, you seem to have a strange fixation for Rambo.Dont make my laugh.
This is real life, not rambo.
US is just one more nation.
You continually mention him.
Take a reality check.
Too much Hollywood, read a book.Too much Spiderman is not good!
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
I talk about Rambo and Spiderman because i see that US makes an entertainment of war, dead and destruction. Its almost impossible to see one US movie without this.
And i want that people realize that its not a mopvie, this is real life. The red cross stop counting the dead people because they where SO MANY... i dont think its nothing nice and i cant see goodness in those who perpetrate those crimes.
Think am minute about that: why is war/violence/murder an entertainment in US movies? Dont you think its consequence of too many wars?
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
Dont worry, i never see movies, i read many books every year (something like 45 per years or even more).I'm concerned for you, you seem to have a strange fixation for Rambo.
You continually mention him.
Take a reality check.
Too much Hollywood, read a book.
I talk about Rambo and Spiderman because i see that US makes an entertainment of war, dead and destruction. Its almost impossible to see one US movie without this.
And i want that people realize that its not a mopvie, this is real life. The red cross stop counting the dead people because they where SO MANY... i dont think its nothing nice and i cant see goodness in those who perpetrate those crimes.
Think am minute about that: why is war/violence/murder an entertainment in US movies? Dont you think its consequence of too many wars?
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
we have several dead soldiers from my area.
Do you even read what you write??Dont worry, i never see movies, i read many books every year (something like 45 per years or even more).
I talk about Rambo and Spiderman because i see that US makes an entertainment of war, dead and destruction. Its almost impossible to see one US movie without this.
Listen upAnd i want that people realize that its not a mopvie, this is real life.
we have several dead soldiers from my area. -
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
Wa was not necessary, it is obvious.
Why start the war just when the UN inspectors was giving some results?
Did you really think that war cant wait 3 weeks?
Rumsfeld travel to Iraq once and give a hugh to Hussein and give him support and weapons (its on US newspapers!)... in that time Saddam was a killer and iraquies where not 'free' and nobody cares.
Saddam was there 24 years... why is the hurry NOW?
The old Bush said in 1990 (more or less) that was the US BEST INTEREST to give money to Saddam Hussein (read US newpapers!).
There is no sense in suddenly be in a hurry to attack Saddam when some time ago nobody was concerned about iraquies.
All those Saddam crimes that hurt you happens when Saddam was a US allie, if you dont believe me read the us old newspapers, the true is there. Read newspapers from 1980 to 1991 you will see that Saddam was an allied of Reagan/Bush, etc.
Don't believe me, don't believe in dissents, believe in the old US newspapers...
Even CIA old papers show the true, read it.
One example:
"It is fair to conclude Bush has not always hated Saddam. Or if he has hated Saddam all these years, he put that hatred aside in the name of statecraft. Reagan, Bush, the Iraqi dictator, and American corporations have worked together over the years. War and death make for good business. It also makes for lies and deception -- and possibly for less than truthful interviews. "
"According to Teicher, he and Donald Rumsfeld traveled to Iraq to make sure the Iraqi dictator received what he needed in order to win the Iran-Iraq war "
http://www.svsu.edu/~boles/111/articles ... ngIraq.htm
From an US university.
In 1982, Reagan "legalized" direct military assistance to Iraq. This resulted in more than a billion dollars in military related exports.
Its easy to find if its true or not.
Even a New York Times pulitzer price said that US gives ANTHRAX to Saddam, check it.
In 1985, the US Centers of Disease Control sent samples of an Israeli strain of West Nile virus to a microbiologist at the Basra University in Iraq. In addition, Iraq received other "various toxins and bacteria," including botulins and E. coli.
Corporations that have sold dual-use chemicals and biological samples to Iraq for its weapons program include: Phillips Petroleum, Unilever, Alcolac, Allied Signal, the American Type Culture Collection, and Teledyne.
The Baltimore company Alcolac was convicted of illegally selling thiodiglycol -- a chemical precursor used in the production of mustard gas -- for use in Iraq's chemical warfare program.
According to another New York Times article (8-29-02) Col. Walter P. Lang, a senior defense intelligence officer at the time, explained that D.I.A. and C.I.A. officials "were desperate to make sure that Iraq did not lose" to Iran. "The use of gas on the battlefield by the Iraqis was not a matter of deep strategic concern," he said. One veteran said, that the Pentagon "wasn't so horrified by Iraq's use of gas." "It was just another way of killing people _ whether with a bullet or phosgene, it didn't make any difference."
The question is not whether Saddam is willing to use chemical or other weapons of mass destruction again. The question is whether the US is willing to sell materials for weapons of mass destruction to dictators and is willing to help them use them.
The following is detailed but only partial listing of biological materials [and excludes all chemical materials], provided by the American Type Culture Collection, which were exported to agencies of the government of Iraq pursuant to the issuance of an export licensed by the U.S. Commerce Department:
Date: February 8, 1985
Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Agency
Materials Shipped:
Ustilago nuda (Jensen) Rostrup
Date: February 22, 1985 Sent to: Ministry of Higher Education
Materials Shipped:
Histoplasma capsulatum var. farciminosum (ATCC 32136)
Class III pathogen
Date: July 11, 1985 Sent to: Middle and Near East Regional A
Materials Shipped:
Histoplasma capsulatum var. farciminosum (ATCC 32136)
Class III pathogen
Date: May 2, 1986 Sent to: Ministry of Higher Education
Materials Shipped:
Bacillus Anthracis Cohn (ATCC 10)
Batch ) 08-20-82 (2 each)
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus Subtilis (Ehrenberg) Cohn (ATCC 82)
Batch ) 06-20-84 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 3502)
Batch) 07-07-81 (3 each)
Class III Pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (Weillon and Zuber) Hauduroy, et al
(ATCC 3624) Batch) 10-85SV (2 each)
Bacillus subtilis (ATCC 6051) Batch) 12-06-84 (2 each)
Francisella tularensis var. tularensis Olsufiev (ATCC 6223)
Batch) 05-14-79 (2 each) Avirulent, suitable for preparations of diagnostic antigens.
Clostridium tetani (ATCC 9441)
Batch) 03-84 (3 each) Highly toxigenic.
Clostridium botulinum Type E (ATCC 9564) Batch) 03-02-79 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium tetani (ATCC 10779) Batch) 04-24-84S (3 each)
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 12916) Batch) 08-14-80 (2 each) Agglutinating type 2.
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 13124)
Batch) 07-84SV (3 each)
Type A, alpha-toxigenic, produces lecithinase C.J. Appl.
Bacillus Anthracis (ATCC 14185)
Batch) 01-14-80 (3 each)
G.G. Wright (Fort Detrick) V770-NP1-R. Bovine anthrax,
Class III pathogen
Bacillus Anthracis (ATCC 14578)
Batch) 01-06-78 (2 each)
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 14581)
Batch) 04-18-85 (2 each)
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 14945)
Batch) 06-21-81 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type E (ATCC 17855)
Batch) 06-21-71
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 19213)
Batch) 3-84 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 19397)
Batch) 08-18-81 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus Biotype 3 (ATCC 23450)
Batch) 08-02-84 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus Biotype 9 (ATCC 23455)
Batch) 02-05-68 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella melitensis Biotype 1 (ATCC 23456)
Batch) 03-08-78 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella melitensis Biotype 3 (ATCC 23458)
Batch) 01-29-68 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 25763)
Batch) 8-83 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type F (ATCC 35415)
Batch) 02-02-84 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Date: August 31, 1987 Sent to: State Company for Drug Industries
Materials Shipped:
Saccharomyces cerevesiae (ATCC 2601)
Batch) 08-28-08 (1 each)
Salmonella choleraesuis subsp. choleraesuis Serotype typhi
(ATCC 6539) Batch) 06-86S (1 each)
Bacillus subtillus (ATCC 6633)
Batch) 10-85 (2 each)
Klebsiella pneumoniae subsp. pneumoniae (ATCC 10031)
Batch) 08-13-80 (1 each)
Escherichia coli (ATCC 10536)
Batch) 04-09-80 (1 each)
Bacillus cereus (11778)
Batch) 05-85SV (2 each)
Staphylococcus epidermidis (ATCC 12228)
Batch) 11-86s (1 each)
Bacillus pumilus (ATCC 14884)
Batch) 09-08-80 (2 each)
Date: July 11, 1988 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Escherichia coli (ATCC 11303)
Batch) 04-87S
Phage host
Cauliflower Mosaic Caulimovirus (ATCC45031)
Batch) 06-14-85
Plant virus
Plasmid in Agrobacterium Tumefaciens (ATCC37349)
(Ti plasmid for co-cultivation with plant integration vectors in E. Coli) Batch) 05-28-85
Date: April 26, 1988 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Hulambda4x-8, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57236) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda14-8, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s): X q26.1 (ATCC 57240) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda15, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57242) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Date: August 31, 1987 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Escherichia coli (ATCC 23846)
Batch) 07-29-83 (1 each)
Escherichia coli (ATCC 33694)
Batch) 05-87 (1 each)
Date: September 29, 1988 Sent to: Ministry of Trade
Materials Shipped:
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 240)
Batch)05-14-63 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 938)
Batch)1963 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 3629)
Batch)10-23-85 (3 each)
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 8009)
Batch)03-30-84 (3 each)
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 8705)
Batch) 06-27-62 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus (ATCC 9014)
Batch) 05-11-66 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 10388)
Batch) 06-01-73 (3 each)
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 11966)
Batch) 05-05-70 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type A
Batch) 07-86 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Bacillus cereus (ATCC 33018)
Batch) 04-83 (3 each)
Bacillus ceres (ATCC 33019)
Batch) 03-88 (3 each)
Date: Janaury 31, 1989 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
PHPT31, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57057)
plambda500, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase pseudogene (HPRT) Chromosome(s): 5 p14-p13 (ATCC 57212)
Date: January 17, 1989 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Hulambda4x-8, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57237) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda14, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s): X q26.1 (ATCC 57240) Cloned from human lymphoblast Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda15, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57241) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli.
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
Claim Bush, he send them to kill and be killed.Listen up
Wa was not necessary, it is obvious.
Why start the war just when the UN inspectors was giving some results?
Did you really think that war cant wait 3 weeks?
Rumsfeld travel to Iraq once and give a hugh to Hussein and give him support and weapons (its on US newspapers!)... in that time Saddam was a killer and iraquies where not 'free' and nobody cares.
Saddam was there 24 years... why is the hurry NOW?
The old Bush said in 1990 (more or less) that was the US BEST INTEREST to give money to Saddam Hussein (read US newpapers!).
There is no sense in suddenly be in a hurry to attack Saddam when some time ago nobody was concerned about iraquies.
All those Saddam crimes that hurt you happens when Saddam was a US allie, if you dont believe me read the us old newspapers, the true is there. Read newspapers from 1980 to 1991 you will see that Saddam was an allied of Reagan/Bush, etc.
Don't believe me, don't believe in dissents, believe in the old US newspapers...
Even CIA old papers show the true, read it.
One example:
"It is fair to conclude Bush has not always hated Saddam. Or if he has hated Saddam all these years, he put that hatred aside in the name of statecraft. Reagan, Bush, the Iraqi dictator, and American corporations have worked together over the years. War and death make for good business. It also makes for lies and deception -- and possibly for less than truthful interviews. "
"According to Teicher, he and Donald Rumsfeld traveled to Iraq to make sure the Iraqi dictator received what he needed in order to win the Iran-Iraq war "
http://www.svsu.edu/~boles/111/articles ... ngIraq.htm
From an US university.
In 1982, Reagan "legalized" direct military assistance to Iraq. This resulted in more than a billion dollars in military related exports.
Its easy to find if its true or not.
Even a New York Times pulitzer price said that US gives ANTHRAX to Saddam, check it.
In 1985, the US Centers of Disease Control sent samples of an Israeli strain of West Nile virus to a microbiologist at the Basra University in Iraq. In addition, Iraq received other "various toxins and bacteria," including botulins and E. coli.
Corporations that have sold dual-use chemicals and biological samples to Iraq for its weapons program include: Phillips Petroleum, Unilever, Alcolac, Allied Signal, the American Type Culture Collection, and Teledyne.
The Baltimore company Alcolac was convicted of illegally selling thiodiglycol -- a chemical precursor used in the production of mustard gas -- for use in Iraq's chemical warfare program.
According to another New York Times article (8-29-02) Col. Walter P. Lang, a senior defense intelligence officer at the time, explained that D.I.A. and C.I.A. officials "were desperate to make sure that Iraq did not lose" to Iran. "The use of gas on the battlefield by the Iraqis was not a matter of deep strategic concern," he said. One veteran said, that the Pentagon "wasn't so horrified by Iraq's use of gas." "It was just another way of killing people _ whether with a bullet or phosgene, it didn't make any difference."
The question is not whether Saddam is willing to use chemical or other weapons of mass destruction again. The question is whether the US is willing to sell materials for weapons of mass destruction to dictators and is willing to help them use them.
The following is detailed but only partial listing of biological materials [and excludes all chemical materials], provided by the American Type Culture Collection, which were exported to agencies of the government of Iraq pursuant to the issuance of an export licensed by the U.S. Commerce Department:
Date: February 8, 1985
Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Agency
Materials Shipped:
Ustilago nuda (Jensen) Rostrup
Date: February 22, 1985 Sent to: Ministry of Higher Education
Materials Shipped:
Histoplasma capsulatum var. farciminosum (ATCC 32136)
Class III pathogen
Date: July 11, 1985 Sent to: Middle and Near East Regional A
Materials Shipped:
Histoplasma capsulatum var. farciminosum (ATCC 32136)
Class III pathogen
Date: May 2, 1986 Sent to: Ministry of Higher Education
Materials Shipped:
Bacillus Anthracis Cohn (ATCC 10)
Batch ) 08-20-82 (2 each)
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus Subtilis (Ehrenberg) Cohn (ATCC 82)
Batch ) 06-20-84 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 3502)
Batch) 07-07-81 (3 each)
Class III Pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (Weillon and Zuber) Hauduroy, et al
(ATCC 3624) Batch) 10-85SV (2 each)
Bacillus subtilis (ATCC 6051) Batch) 12-06-84 (2 each)
Francisella tularensis var. tularensis Olsufiev (ATCC 6223)
Batch) 05-14-79 (2 each) Avirulent, suitable for preparations of diagnostic antigens.
Clostridium tetani (ATCC 9441)
Batch) 03-84 (3 each) Highly toxigenic.
Clostridium botulinum Type E (ATCC 9564) Batch) 03-02-79 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium tetani (ATCC 10779) Batch) 04-24-84S (3 each)
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 12916) Batch) 08-14-80 (2 each) Agglutinating type 2.
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 13124)
Batch) 07-84SV (3 each)
Type A, alpha-toxigenic, produces lecithinase C.J. Appl.
Bacillus Anthracis (ATCC 14185)
Batch) 01-14-80 (3 each)
G.G. Wright (Fort Detrick) V770-NP1-R. Bovine anthrax,
Class III pathogen
Bacillus Anthracis (ATCC 14578)
Batch) 01-06-78 (2 each)
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 14581)
Batch) 04-18-85 (2 each)
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 14945)
Batch) 06-21-81 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type E (ATCC 17855)
Batch) 06-21-71
Class III pathogen.
Bacillus megaterium (ATCC 19213)
Batch) 3-84 (2 each)
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 19397)
Batch) 08-18-81 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus Biotype 3 (ATCC 23450)
Batch) 08-02-84 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus Biotype 9 (ATCC 23455)
Batch) 02-05-68 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella melitensis Biotype 1 (ATCC 23456)
Batch) 03-08-78 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella melitensis Biotype 3 (ATCC 23458)
Batch) 01-29-68 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type A (ATCC 25763)
Batch) 8-83 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type F (ATCC 35415)
Batch) 02-02-84 (2 each)
Class III pathogen
Date: August 31, 1987 Sent to: State Company for Drug Industries
Materials Shipped:
Saccharomyces cerevesiae (ATCC 2601)
Batch) 08-28-08 (1 each)
Salmonella choleraesuis subsp. choleraesuis Serotype typhi
(ATCC 6539) Batch) 06-86S (1 each)
Bacillus subtillus (ATCC 6633)
Batch) 10-85 (2 each)
Klebsiella pneumoniae subsp. pneumoniae (ATCC 10031)
Batch) 08-13-80 (1 each)
Escherichia coli (ATCC 10536)
Batch) 04-09-80 (1 each)
Bacillus cereus (11778)
Batch) 05-85SV (2 each)
Staphylococcus epidermidis (ATCC 12228)
Batch) 11-86s (1 each)
Bacillus pumilus (ATCC 14884)
Batch) 09-08-80 (2 each)
Date: July 11, 1988 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Escherichia coli (ATCC 11303)
Batch) 04-87S
Phage host
Cauliflower Mosaic Caulimovirus (ATCC45031)
Batch) 06-14-85
Plant virus
Plasmid in Agrobacterium Tumefaciens (ATCC37349)
(Ti plasmid for co-cultivation with plant integration vectors in E. Coli) Batch) 05-28-85
Date: April 26, 1988 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Hulambda4x-8, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57236) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda14-8, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s): X q26.1 (ATCC 57240) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda15, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57242) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Date: August 31, 1987 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Escherichia coli (ATCC 23846)
Batch) 07-29-83 (1 each)
Escherichia coli (ATCC 33694)
Batch) 05-87 (1 each)
Date: September 29, 1988 Sent to: Ministry of Trade
Materials Shipped:
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 240)
Batch)05-14-63 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 938)
Batch)1963 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 3629)
Batch)10-23-85 (3 each)
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 8009)
Batch)03-30-84 (3 each)
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 8705)
Batch) 06-27-62 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Brucella abortus (ATCC 9014)
Batch) 05-11-66 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium perfringens (ATCC 10388)
Batch) 06-01-73 (3 each)
Bacillus anthracis (ATCC 11966)
Batch) 05-05-70 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Clostridium botulinum Type A
Batch) 07-86 (3 each)
Class III pathogen
Bacillus cereus (ATCC 33018)
Batch) 04-83 (3 each)
Bacillus ceres (ATCC 33019)
Batch) 03-88 (3 each)
Date: Janaury 31, 1989 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
PHPT31, clone: human hypoxanthine
phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57057)
plambda500, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase pseudogene (HPRT) Chromosome(s): 5 p14-p13 (ATCC 57212)
Date: January 17, 1989 Sent to: Iraq Atomic Energy Commission
Materials Shipped:
Hulambda4x-8, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57237) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda14, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s): X q26.1 (ATCC 57240) Cloned from human lymphoblast Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli
Hulambda15, clone: human hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT) Chromosome(s) X q26.1 (ATCC 57241) Phage vector; Suggested host: E.coli.
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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BackupUser
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
New York Times reporter Nicholas Kristof futher explained that "But when Mr. Cheney was running Halliburton, the oil services firm, it sold more equipment to Iraq than any other company did. As first reported by The Financial Times on Nov. 3, 2000, Halliburton subsidiaries submitted $23.8 million worth of contracts with Iraq to the United Nations in 1998 and 1999 for approval by its sanctions committee."
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
New York Times reporter Nicholas Kristof futher explained that "But when Mr. Cheney was running Halliburton, the oil services firm, it sold more equipment to Iraq than any other company did. As first reported by The Financial Times on Nov. 3, 2000, Halliburton subsidiaries submitted $23.8 million worth of contracts with Iraq to the United Nations in 1998 and 1999 for approval by its sanctions committee."
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
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BackupUser
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Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by wayne1.
I understand you hate the USA (but why you allow your parents to stay here I'll never know.) and any further posts to you are a waste of time if your lucky maybe another dictator will take over Argentina and will find happiness.
Bye.
You repeat the same thing over and over we have already answered you!The old Bush said in 1990 (more or less) that was the US BEST INTEREST to give money to Saddam Hussein (read US newpapers!).
I understand you hate the USA (but why you allow your parents to stay here I'll never know.) and any further posts to you are a waste of time if your lucky maybe another dictator will take over Argentina and will find happiness.
Bye.
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BackupUser
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- Posts: 16777133
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 7:42 pm
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by ricardo.
I dont hate US, i hate Bush and his craziness!!
Which scenario is more possible???????
Bye
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...
I dont hate US, i hate Bush and his craziness!!
If your lucky maybe another terrorist will blow up US and will find happinesif your lucky maybe another dictator will take over Argentina and will find happiness.
Bye.
Which scenario is more possible???????
Bye
Best Regards
Ricardo
Dont cry for me Argentina...