PureBasic Forums - English

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

HI fred,
that answer are now your final words and i agree with you and accept this way! Having a nice future for pure... Thx!

greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by koehler.


Fred, as for the customer service, I think you do a very good job, in fact in most areas better than Blitz as I mentioned; as you are always here answering questions directly. The thing I think would be great would be some sort of work log where you discuss what you've fixed, what you are working on in the short term. Unless I have missed that post, apologies.

As for the OpenGL/DX thread, I think people (myself included) just needed a more explicit post from you indicating that OpenGL Ogre was distinctly possible. If DX is the primary now because it is the fastest, thats fine. However, it wasn't clear to me if OpenGL (Windows) is a 'will do' or a 'might do'.

I just don't know what would be involved in porting to Linux if the PB-Windows is using DX.


thanks.



--
1980 Applesoft Basic, '81 6502 Assembler, '82 Pascal, '96 C, '00 Blitz Basic
2003 Pure Basic - History does repeat itself.

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

Hi koehler,
i have to agree with you in all your arguments!

greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by dmoc.

Me too.

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by THCM.

Yes indeed! Way to go Fred!

The Human Code Machine / Masters' Design Group

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by alizta.

i don't agree to most negative arguments here. 1MB engine is realy ok - i mean, hey, it has wrappers for DX and OpenGl. with all backrenderers even the quake2 engine reaches that size. but there is one concern i do have: can ogre use only BSP maps from Quake(1-3)? i know that there is no way of selling games which use id's level format without buying a licens from id software. there was arguing with john carmack about this issue and his point seems very clear about this. i don't expect to see a fullblown commercial 3d game with any of the modern basic dialects, but i do expect to be able to sell small games via garagegames or recieve money for creating small advertisement games for someone.

---when all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail... ---

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

HI alizta,
welcome to pure... The engine for windows use only DX and not as you think DX and OGL in one! So there must be two libs... one for Dx and one for OGL! I dont agree that Orgw should support "ONLY" bsp... this should be optional and modular to the user! Maybe there are any other and maybe free formats available, that users can use/support.. Or someone will try to write an new one pure format with converter

I think everybody think on another way or dont care about filesize (engine dll) n today times where harddrives are 80 GB and more... I think this topic has only such a big discussion due fact of five points:

- Why DLL instead Lib (read on this forum, not everybody is happy with this solution) but as we all may know, its the first step into 3d for pure... so we have to wait and see.

- Filesize of 3D Engine (Maybe dont care about sizes in today time but maybe some other persons care about size and wanna a more smaller engine... and maybe even more a engine based on splitted Lib!?

- Create Objects (Nearly every 3d engine has commands to create onw standart 3d obejcts and this is still missed in the first release...

- 3D Collision (What is the best free Engine without real collision detection?) ;*)

- DX or OGL in future (I think this is the most important and discussed stuff here... ppl heared a lot of rumours and nobody was really sure which way Fred will go in future for Windows and Linux... But finaly Fred wrote final words to this

We all know that the 3D stuff in pure is just the first start, so let us wait and see how ever topic points will be changed or going on in future...

greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by koehler.


And of course, people who really want to see certain features in Ogre should probably be pestering the Ogre folks, and not Fred. Some of the things people want ( smaller engine ) are really almost like asking Fred to build a brand new engine. That would be a big time commitment, and not good from a cost/benefit point of view, considering what other stuff he could have been working on during that time....

http://ogre.sourceforge.net/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=3

--
1980 Applesoft Basic, '81 6502 Assembler, '82 Pascal, '96 C, '00 Blitz Basic
2003 Pure Basic - History does repeat itself.

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by koehler.


Again, using the proper forum one can find such info out -directly from the developer of Ogre- :

http://ogre.sourceforge.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=788

--
1980 Applesoft Basic, '81 6502 Assembler, '82 Pascal, '96 C, '00 Blitz Basic
2003 Pure Basic - History does repeat itself.

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

Hi koehler, i never said that Fred should complete write a new own engine! I only said and still think that the size of the DLL engine is big in my eyes and that it would make more sence to use the stuff like a splitted pure lib. Nothing else

AS i know, the Ogre engine has build in some stuff that not really needed!? So let us wait for future versions, even since fred has wrote his statement to this.

greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by alizta.

-i don't know what is wrong with having a dll. the only reason i could imagine is that maybe someone want's to hide the fact that his program uses ogre. but think of the advances; patches that you write for your program will be *tiny*, when the engine (which is well tested) is seperated from the main program.

- 3d engine features: admitted, the engine is not of any real value right now, but that was clear from the beginning. it will mature.

- DX or OpenGL: i don't see why anyone should even think about this from the PureBasic users point of view. it is hidden from us anyway, isn't it? fred should make this decisions undisturbed, espacially since the answer on which is the better api is only to be based on personal preference - both api's are a valid and good solution. every 3d accelerated graphics board has good drivers for both on windows.



-ogre forum: ah i see... okay. that kills my concern... let's see what they will come up with

---when all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail... ---

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

- DX or OpenGL: i don't see why anyone should even think about this from the PureBasic users point of view. it is hidden from us anyway, isn't it?

This point was already answered by fred! And i dont want to use any 3d engine where i am not sure if its based on DX, OGL or whatever... When i want to code a game or app using 3D engine, i want to tell the enduser what the program will support and not to tell that my prog featuring a cool 3d engine but they have to find it self out on which stuff it is based!

I am still looking forward for the very promizing and nice work on the small Spy3dEngine for pure by BalrogSoft! Keep on your great work, BalrogSoft


greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by dmoc.

For anyone who is interested I have recently had SceneLib
(http://www.marcus-software.ch/scenelib/) working from PB and will soon be
trying Quesa (http://www.quesa.org/). SceneLib performs really well on my
200MHz notebook but is not free and I haven't been able to contact the author
since first trying a week or two ago. Quesa is open source LGPL and looks
very capable.

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by THCM.

Hi!

I think Fred did the right decision on choosing Ogre. Ogre has a very good community and most of the stuff integrated we'll need. I made some tests with the new Exporter from 3DS-Max 5 with skeletons and it works great! Ogre was made under the aspect of supporting many types of games and is in no way specialized on a single genre.

Yours,

The Human Code Machine / Masters' Design Group

Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.

@THCM: i agree but Fred should first fix all known bugs and adding features nearly other language support for coding high professional appz! If this all is done and works fine, then fred and the comunity can try and concentrate to add and support 3d stuff in pure!

greetz
MrVainSCL! aka Thorsten

PIII450, 256MB Ram, 80GB HD + 6,4 GB, RivaTNT, DirectX9.0, SB AWE64, Win2000 + all Updates...