PureBasic Forums - English

J. Baker wrote:Intel chips are usually not supported by most games or 3D editors as they are not up to par with Nvidia or ATI. I take it you are on a laptop, being that it's a mobile chip?

Most Intel chips are more than capable of handling PowerBasic's capabilities. The exception is really old Intel chips like the GMA 900 which will often crap out on D3D7 (and DX9), but will handle DD7 and OpenGL just fine.

The 945GM should be more than adequate for casual games and some light 3D games, but unlike the newer Intel chips, you aren't going to be able to run any of the latest 3D games. If you can afford it, it is usually best to pay the $50 extra and get the next higher model of the laptop/netbook that has an ATI or NVIDIA chip. Unfortunately, due to Intel's borderline-illegal practices, this may not always be possible for laptops/netbooks if you want an Intel CPU.

This laptop is about (or over?) 5 years old... I plan to finally upgrade when I get a new job in the next few months.

I play more 2D games than 3D... and any 3D games I play are usually as old as the laptop So it hasn't been a big problem for me. I used to play Doom 3 on this when it came out, but at the lowest graphics settings.

@Kuron, I worded that poorly... I meant that Intel's update utility says I'm up to date, not Windows'!

Anyway, I only use DisplayTranslucentSprite() for a color-tinting effect over the whole screen (that has already been drawn normally). Could I achieve this with a Sprite3D by scaling it to the whole screen and giving it transparency? I will try that, if I solve this blank white issue.

Since my first introduction to Intel graphic chips back in 2000, there have always been issues with them. Mostly just read about other users issues, as I didn't buy a machine after 2000 with an Intel graphics chip.

kenmo wrote:This laptop is about (or over?) 5 years old... I plan to finally upgrade when I get a new job in the next few months.

I play more 2D games than 3D... and any 3D games I play are usually as old as the laptop So it hasn't been a big problem for me. I used to play Doom 3 on this when it came out, but at the lowest graphics settings.

@Kuron, I worded that poorly... I meant that Intel's update utility says I'm up to date, not Windows'!

Anyway, I only use DisplayTranslucentSprite() for a color-tinting effect over the whole screen (that has already been drawn normally). Could I achieve this with a Sprite3D by scaling it to the whole screen and giving it transparency? I will try that, if I solve this blank white issue.

If anything, just go buy an old tower pc or sometimes you can find them for free. Then you could get a graphics card for it, if it doesn't already have an Ati or Nvidia one. I still play games on my old Pentium III 850 with 512MB from time to time. Mainly for Dos or Glide games.

Anyways, it would be a cheap solution for development.

kenmo wrote:@Kuron, I worded that poorly... I meant that Intel's update utility says I'm up to date, not Windows'!

You can't go by that as it will take the version info from MS's drivers which can have the latest version number, yet will not have OpenGL support.

The link to direct downloads in my previous post will have the real drivers. I have an Eee 701 4G Surf netbook with an Intel 910GML chip which is much older than your chip and it will run PB's OpenGL just fine if the proper drivers are installed.

If you want to play the latest mainstream titles (and have a decent experience) Gaming should not be done on a laptop, unless you are willing to pay for a very high-end model, or an even more custom laptop-type mini computer (I've seen them before, much thicker than a laptop but they can house a desktop GPU).


I briefly looked into Netbooks and Laptops as a birthday gift, and even the mobility chips unless you go very high end, are complete crap.. Which surprises me given the low resolutions we are talking about in most cases. You'd think an affordable ($500 or less) Laptop would have a GPU capable of at least 720p without choking up and running at 5FPS.

$1k would probably be the minimum starting price for any kind of decent laptop for 3D gaming. But if 3D gaming is not a big concern, then you can just ignore everything I said

@Kuron, thanks for the advice but I've had no luck so far! I've completely uninstalled my display drivers, downloaded the latest versions directly from Intel, installed (tried the two latest versions) and rebooted, checked that I have a supported OpenGL version (1.4)...... but I still get blank white sprites in PureBasic.

(I still don't think it's a PB-specific problem... if anyone can point me to an OpenGL sprite/drawing demo in any other language, I can try that.)

I guess I'll stick to DirectX on Windows -- besides, I read in other threads that OpenGL is slower at 2D, so maybe it's not worth it to support both? Or maybe I'll find a second computer later, and test an OGL version on that? ...... I'm getting ahead of myself.

@Zach, when I post screenshots of my game, you'll see how graphics-intense games I play .

kenmo wrote:(I still don't think it's a PB-specific problem... if anyone can point me to an OpenGL sprite/drawing demo in any other language, I can try that.)

Here you go. This is a sample (I didn't write it) from Blitz Plus that I compiled to use OpenGL. *edit* As an FYI, this example flies on my Eee 701 4G Surf netbook (Intel 910GML chip).

kenmo wrote:I read in other threads that OpenGL is slower at 2D, so maybe it's not worth it to support both?

DX9 is the default choice in PB. DX9 handles 2D much in the same way that OpenGL does, which is they don't. Both use 3D methods to emulate 2D. True 2D pretty much died with DirectDraw 7.

DX9 or OpenGL, you need to make sure any sprites are in a power of 2 or you will run into issues on some graphics cards.

kenmo wrote:@Zach, when I post screenshots of my game, you'll see how graphics-intense games I play .

Diehard retro gamer?

Kuron wrote:DX9 is the default choice in PB. DX9 handles 2D much in the same way that OpenGL does, which is they don't. Both use 3D methods to emulate 2D. True 2D pretty much died with DirectDraw 7.

DX9 or OpenGL, you need to make sure any sprites are in a power of 2 or you will run into issues on some graphics cards.

I still prefer Directx7 on windows for 2D. OpenGL otherwise.

As for the power of 2. I've read that even though newer graphic cards support non-power of 2, it runs slower through the graphics card memory. Or something like that. It's best to use sprite sheets and clip them.

J. Baker wrote:I still prefer Directx7 on windows for 2D.

Unfortunately it is not supported on Vista and 7. At runtime the API calls are converted to the new equivalents and you are actually using "2D in 3D" whether you want to or not.

J. Baker wrote:I've read that even though newer graphic cards support non-power of 2, it runs slower through the graphics card memory.

IIRC. it can be slower because the images will automatically be resized to the nearest power of 2.

Kuron wrote:IIRC. it can be slower because the images will automatically be resized to the nearest power of 2.

This is exactly what I have tried to explain to other game developers. But yet you'll still see game making apps and developers ignore this because they see that graphics cards will handle it either way. I wish ATI and Nvidia would disable or not allow non-power of 2 images. This alone would force developers to produce optimized games. Now of course, that's not the only method but it would help.

EDIT: Sorry, I think I went a bit off topic with this.

J. Baker wrote:But yet you'll still see game making apps and developers ignore this because they see that graphics cards will handle it either way.

Why do things the right way when you can do it half-assed? LOL, that seems to be the motto so many people use for development.

Kuron wrote:Here you go. This is a sample (I didn't write it) from Blitz Plus that I compiled to use OpenGL. *edit* As an FYI, this example flies on my Eee 701 4G Surf netbook (Intel 910GML chip).

That works fine... hmm... ahhh I'm gonna give up for now.

Kuron wrote:Diehard retro gamer?

Nah not really. My current project isn't really retro, just minimalist-ish... it's all drawn in manual 2D, not even sprites.