Re: Fun with SSD's
Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 2:04 am
I'm just waiting for them to come down in price to something reasonable, then I'll replace my mechanical drives with SSDs both for reliability and speed.
No. All the fear about limited write cycles is nonsense.blueznl wrote: Just a question to all SSD users: did you move your temp folder to a regular drive? I see comments all over the place, some pro, some con. I could image some issues if you're packing / unpacking all day using the temp folder, but for every day use... Dunno.
Do the Temp and swap files change when you edit a document, or change program focus? If so, your calculations are about 10x too generous (to be generous).Thorium wrote:...I did calculated it for my SSD as i bought it. And i got about 30 years life time (show me a HDD that lasts that long) if i write half of the disk every day (which i dont do).
On Windows systems the temp files change often and depending on memory utilization and other factors so does the swap file. What I have done to reduce wear on my SSD and improve performance is to change the location of the temp file by changing the environmental variables %TMP% and %TEMP% to a ram drive folder such as R:\Temp. This also works for temporary internet files in Internet Explorer and other browsers. If you have enough memory or a big enough ram drive you can relocate the swap file to the ram drive or disable the swap file altogether. I chose to relocate my swap file to a standard hard drive. Although many are available I use a free RAM disk application called SoftPerfect RAM Disk. Be sure to use Add Boot Disk from the main menu which will create a RAM disk available immediately on system startup.Tenaja wrote: Do the Temp and swap files change when you edit a document, or change program focus? If so, your calculations are about 10x too generous (to be generous).
I do not know the specifics behind temp and swap file locations, but I am just saying if they are not relocated with each write, then your calculations are nowhere near accurate.
So? A cell can take millions of writes befor it fails. The controler of the SSD will distribute writes over the cells (it relocates data automaticly), so even if you write the same file twice, it will be 2 write accesses to different cells. On top of that SSD's have cells in reserve in case cells start to fail, they will be replaced. That counters cells that only last the minimum of cycles.Tenaja wrote: I know I swap back and forth between programs much more than 10x a day, and depending on which programs and files I have open, each switch causes a read and a new write to the swap files. If Windows does not force relocation of the swap file with each write, then that wear is a lot more than 2/day.
Even with PB alone, I recompile much more than 10x a day; sometimes 100's of times, depending on the status of the project I am working on.
You will love the Samsung 840 Evo it's the best drive on the market right now. Also be sure to check out the RAPID technology in the Magician software. You do not have to do anything once you install the drive and OS. Windows 7 and later, and newer linux kernels both automatically configure the OS for the SSD. What I mean by that is Windows will automatically turn off its defragmenter tool since it is not need to save on unnecessary writes. As for all of the "SSD's are limited to write cycles" rumors, it is all true. Tho they were not clear as to how many the drive will handle before it does die. The Samsung 840 250GB was put to the test not once but twice against a synthetic test. You might find the results a bit shocking.blueznl wrote:3 years later...Yeah, I'm a late adapter I guess
I just bought a Samsung 840 Evo to replace my aging WD Velociraptor Raid 0 pair. Few years ago I had a first attempt with XP and an Intel drive which didn't work out, now it's a rematch, this time with Windows 7 and the Samsung Evo...
Just a question to all SSD users: did you move your temp folder to a regular drive? I see comments all over the place, some pro, some con. I could image some issues if you're packing / unpacking all day using the temp folder, but for every day use... Dunno.
Currently my second drive (containing the temp folder) was a Caviar Black 1TB. With mechanical drives I prefer to have the temp folder on another drive, and some testing seemed to keep the system just a minor little bit faster with the temp drive not on the Raid 0. Could be psychological though
Anyway, a Caviar black has 64 MB of cache and is pretty fast, so it did a good job. This time I'm thinking leaving the temp file on the SSD. Any suggestions / advice?
(Is PureBasic actually using the temp folder?)
Full article here if you're interested.During the test we received many requests from readers to also test the data retention. It's a valid point, as it could very well be the case that after many write cycles, the memory cells could lose their data when they don't receive power. To find out, we took a second system and turned it off half a day each week after about 3,000 cycles. We even turned it off an entire weekend. It didn't run into any problems, so the retention part seems to be in order.
The second SSD had its first re-allocated sector on May 28 after 3,152 cycles and 745 TiB of written data. The first uncorrectable error occurred on May 30 after 3,247 cycles and 768 TiB of written data. It has completely died yet, and it's passed 4,000 cycles now, but it's also accumulated more than 58,000 uncorrectable errors. We'd call it clinically dead.
So let's calculate the lifespan. We consider the first uncorrectable error to be the end of the SSD. For the first one that was after 764 TiB of written data, and for the second one that was after 768 TiB of written data. That the two failed so close together could indicate that the lifespan of the Samsung 840 SSDs is fairly constant. However, two SSDs aren't representative of the thousands that are out there.
If we take the 764 TiB and an average of 10 GiB of writes per day, we arrive at a lifespan of 214 years. Keep in mind that we sequentially write and fill the SSD which gives us write amplification factor of only 1.04 or 1.05. That's the difference between the write commands sent to the SSD and the writes executed by the SSD internally. The general assumption is a WAF of around 3.0 for normal consumer use with SSDs that don't employ compression tricks. That translates to a lifespan of 75 years. Even when you push an SSD to the max by downloading lots of movies everyday up to an average of 30 GiB per day, the SSD will still last you 24 years. Nomatter how you use it, it will last longer than the period you plan on using it (most people like to add more capacity after a certain time). A functional lifespan of 10 years is already unusually high for a storage medium.
With an average lifespan of 75 years for the TLC memory chips, consumers have absolutely nothing to worry about. It doesn't mean the SSD will actually last 75 years, but the number of available write cycles will not be the bottleneck. That means we will amend our conclusion from a couple months ago. A Samsung 840 SSD with TLC memory is just as reliable as SSDs with MLC memory, and the type of memory should not be a reason to choose one SSD over another.
Which a. wouldn't install, and b. might not be that effective, Windows itself already does a lot of caching. The few tests dealing with Rapid made it look like just another read / write cache. And c. I have a mere 4 GB of Ram, throwing away 1 GB to a cache might not make too much sense.Opcode wrote: You will love the Samsung 840 Evo it's the best drive on the market right now. Also be sure to check out the RAPID technology in the Magician software.
Well, that's if your hardware is properly recognized, I did not have to enable trim, but I did have to disable prefetch, defragment and so on.Opcode wrote: You do not have to do anything once you install the drive and OS. Windows 7 and later