Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.
Kanati wrote:
Until they announce it, keep your @#$%@ speculation to yourself.
Hi Kanati!
I think you are right - let us wait until BlitzMax will be available to see how mutch it will finaly cost - BUT please dont try to offend any guys (its not very nice)... and hey, i like to see any discussions and speculations as long as they dont get in war... I think a forum is to discuse any stuff too on a friendly and realistic way...
bye
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by Hi-Toro.
Sorry, gotta respond to this thread, because a lot of it's just plain wrong!
I actually got that number from someone inside the Blitz organization.
Shane, I would be *fascinated* to know who! The 'Blitz organisation' effectively consists of Mark, Guildhall and Blitz Support (ie. me) -- that's excluding the beta testers, of course, who simply don't get that kind of information any earlier than anyone else. I know that no-one at Guildhall would give you that kind of info (unless someone there thought it amusing to watch you post that kind of speculation)...
Mark himself has said something in the region of $100-200 for a 'similar feature set' to Blitz3D. That's as close a guess as *anyone* can make at this point, and is *not at all* final.
And MrVain, I generally respond to nearly every email I get at [url]mailto:support@blitzbasic.com">support@blitzbasic.com or [url]mailto:blitzsupport@guildhallleisure.com[/url] , whether a reply is needed or not! I honestly don't recall ever receiving any mails from you (because I would remember your name from the AmiBlitz list
(Oh, and no flames intended to any of the above -- just wanted to correct a few things!)
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by blue-speed.
Hi!
one of the importantly things in pb is that we can talk DIRECTLY to the main programmer fred, so when we have any important command or bug then fred put or fix it immediatly . In PB the coders tell what not/to put in the updates , so there are no contra opinions like some people for example shane with OGL in bbmax. The bb support inst like that, Mark sounds like a MegaStar ive never saw him in the bbchat and ive saw only some posts in the bbforum, so how can we talk about the future of bb?? Mark makes bb like he wishs. Not like Fred, he is the most one who posts here and he is very often in the PB chat so the coders can tell what they want for updates. I dont mean that mark is a satan and fred a angel, i know mark works hard on bb and thats good and fred works on pb hard, too but there is a different we can talk to fred. that means:
1 : 0 for Purebasic.
Next fact :
200$ ? wait let me calculate that:
BB2D 60 $
BB3D 150 $
BBMax 200 $
hm.. 410$ that sounds like Micr$soft!! Is that a update? hehe and some of the bb users are laughing about the DB game license? Ok let the PB users laugh about the DB license and the BB $$$updates . I think fred know that he must work harder for pb version 3.0 cz bbmax will be released soon, so i think there wont be a big different between the features of bbmax and pb 3.0, and when there isnt a big different in features but a big different in the price
PB = 59$
BBmax = 200$
then the newbie coders will use pb *juhu
that means:
2:0 for Purebasic.
next fact:
Purebasic havent so much Game commands (at the moment). But u can use PB for games and programms, bb is only for games.
3:0 for Purebasic
so where is the problem? It only a question of time then pb get to a rival of c/c++ .
Fred keep up the good work on pb and u ll got many fans
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by MrVainSCL.
Hi blue-speed!
Yes, i agree with you... PureBasic has really the best support i have ever seen for any program or company!!! Really great work Fred! I would like to see PB3.0... Fred, we love you
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by Hi-Toro.
Yeah, I'll agree that Fred's great! On this though...
Next fact :
200$ ? wait let me calculate that:
BB2D 60 $
BB3D 150 $
BBMax 200 $
hm.. 410$ that sounds like Micr$soft!!
This isn't the case. PB's definitely cheaper, no argument, but the above are in fact separate products, and updates to each of these have always been free (and there have been lots of updates, often adding 'big' features); also, there have always been upgrade prices for people who own a 'previous' version of Blitz, so you can't just add these up and claim that this is what people have to pay to buy all these versions.
Note that I'm not saying anything like "Blitz Vs PB", because I like and use them both; I just want to correct comments that are plain old wrong!
hm... ok but that means mark must update all products separate. If anyone want to buy only bb2d not bmax then he'll get the 2d updates fast? no why? cz mark(the only main programmer) must update at first blitzmax then blitz3d and after this when u have luck then he dosent forget to update bb2d. But i think bb2d will get old and mark will forget to update it. I know BB2d is very fast there are many commands but its not "perfect" and they are many 2d freakz like me woh want to programm 2d games . And now ive heared that a new separate product will came out blitz professional ? Isnt that to much for one programmer he must update BB2D,BB3D,BBMAX,BBProffesional all this products are separat like u say. Ok forget the microsoft opinion but there is a new opinion "very slow updates cz 4 separate products or the updates for all will take a long time to release it". 4:0 for pb
its only my opinion about that so dont understand it wrong i like blitzbasic but sometimes i missed things like appilication and i dont like "special theme programming languages"(yeah that sounds cool).
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by DarkUni.
I wasn't planning on dragging this thread out anymore ...
James, I'd rather not disclose where I got the information, but if I hadn't felt confident about where it came from, I wouldn't have mentioned it. Regardless, if it HAD been that number (for argument's sake) the negative impact of that will surely have changed the mindset of Guildhall and the value would HAVE to be lower now. Perhaps my source meant $200 PER COMPILER, meaning if you wanted what is initially promised (Linux + Mac compilers) it would cost you an ADDITIONAL $400 atop what you paid for in the beginning for the original Windows product.
I apologize for any confusion. Like I said, I wouldn't have said anything just to make something up.
My biggest hang up with Blitz Basic at this point is what I call the 'orphaned user' syndrome. And Blitz isn't the only product that has gone through this processes.
Many of you are familiar with MAME, the multiple arcade machine emulator. Its characteristic of MAME to add drivers that are 'incomplete', then continue to add more drivers without ever fixing what they added before. Hundreds of games would be added before a glaring error would be repaired in an existing driver. Sure, if you are a Capcom System 2 freak, MAME's decision to support you by adding working CPS2 drivers is 'approved' and works for you. But if what you REALLY wanted to do was play FRONT LINE or TOP GUNNER properly, well; too bad. This is the orphaned user syndrome.
Mark Sibly is brilliant. He's one of the most talented programmers I know - both on the Amiga and the PC. He brought FPS to the Amiga with GLOOM (brilliant piece of work). He brought us GUARDIAN and its PC equivelant. The man is a genious - and Blitz Basic is nothing short of AMAZING considering its really the fruit of ONE MAN'S labor (as is PB under Fred).
The point is; he is just ONE MAN. Sure, the community stepped in and helped out alot. But when it comes to producing product, he's just one guy. For any product to be successful, it needs dedication and devotion. Mark simply cannot handle running three products on his own (he's brilliant, not a god) and certainly it makes sense that he "lesser" (i.e. makes the least money) product will get discontinued in terms of development. However, there are so many things that we still need as devoted 2D game developers - and the superceeding product (based on OpenGL) isn't an option for those of us that understand the concept of support and distrobution for product (Windows XP has ZERO OpenGL support). So those of us with dreams of continuing development for 2D using DirectX are out of luck. We have been (or soon shall be) orphaned.
That's my qualms with Blitz Basic right now. I'm sad, too, because I've put a lot of effort and love into Blitz 2D and projects I'm working on with it. Any sort of long dev process gets you intimate with a language - and as much as I love Blitz, if I cannot expect to be updated and my cried heard, how can one be expected to continue development?
Honestly, if Fred closed the doors and said "PB will stop at 2.90 - you take it as it is ... Look for PB Deluxe in a few months that will be slanted more toward gaming and have no more GUI" ... How many of you would bail? How many of you would want to continue supporting PB knowing your 2.9 license was pretty much the last version you would get?
Mark HAS added some things to BB2D since BlitzMax development started. It would be completely unfair for me to say otherwise. However, its simply a matter of time and numbers, logically, before BB2D is simply a memory and it will be OpenGL all the way (sigh ... how it saddens me). Sure, someone will write a directX wrapper for BMax, but then you're going through the beta process ALL over again, begging the wrapper guy to add features, etc.
I'm just babbling now. I'll leave it at that. Blug ....
Restored from previous forum. Originally posted by Hi-Toro.
Well, I disagree and think Mark will support his existing users just fine (I believe he keeps everything very modular, hence the ability to update both '2D and '3D with the same new features at the same time -- where features are shared of course -- and I'd imagine that will be how he'll continue).
Time will tell, though, so there's not much point in us debating this, IMHO
