Linspire

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Dummy
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Post by Dummy »

First thing I do when trying a lonux distro is to open up the media player called xplay or something, start a video and watch it crash after sometime.
yes maybe, but my windows media player also crashes, and it dosent crash just the app as in linux, but takes my whole explorer.exe down.!
@Both: install the correct Codecs and you won't have any problems on both, Linux AND Windows!!!

___________________________________

OK, and now let's interrupt the discussion "Windows vs. Linux" for a few Posts.

I'm having real trouble installing SuSE Linux64 9.1 on the same HDD as Windows XP Pro, because after the install neither GRUB nor LILO nor the XP CD is Booting (both freeze while scanning the HDD).

Can someone help me? Is there a "How to install (SuSE-)Linux on the same HDD as WinXP Pro"?

Just for info: I don't have a Floppy drive!
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Emotional arguments versus logic

Post by Fangbeast »

GeoTrail wrote:Yes, and who makes viruses for Windows?
Linux users !!

I've tried almost every Linux distro there is, including the latest Mandrake 10. First thing I do when trying a lonux distro is to open up the media player called xplay or something, start a video and watch it crash after sometime. And that program comes with just about every version of Linux for the desktop user.

And, Linux is like Windows, it is the 3rd party applications that makes them unstable and crash. Install Windows XP or 2003 Server on a machine and run it and see if you can get it to crash without installing external apps and unsigned drivers.
1. Linux users make windows viruses? That's not only a nasty allegation but unrealistic and illogical. Every linux user I know worth their salt that I know of are busy working hard making a living and take no notice of Windows, they don't need to. People who actually know linux well enough to write viruses don't need to nor want to, they have a system that works well.

2. Ive played with many Linux variants over the last 10 years and when I have used hardware not covered by the linux that I was using, I was able to make various parts crash too. But when I use hardware in the reccomened list (every read me and howto on every distribution ever released) then I have had no problem. With Xplay on the reccomended hardware, it always played my movies from start to finish without a problem.

Then again, i've had help from people who knew linux and configured it CORRECTLY, something you obviously failed to do.

3. This last part of your argument is falacious and shows an extreme ignorance of operating systems basics. ANY OS can be crashed by bad software. But a. implying that a system will not crash without addition third party software is wrong (And I have 25 years experience to back that up) and b. Not installing 3'rd party software means you cannot do all the things an operating system was designed for as most O/s's have the bare minimum and we are almost driven to find better. If an O/S crashes with badly written software, then the O/S should be written better as most software authors that I have met can write great software but cannot match those that write at the kernel level.

Please stick to facts and not offensive comments.
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merendo
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Post by merendo »

@Dummy: You might want to try Knoppix. It's a Linux distro which runs from CD (I guess you already know it). Perhaps it will help you: http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html

===

Ups, 'tschuldigung! Jetzt seh ich erst, dass Du ja auch Deutscher bist. Das hab ich vorhin nicht gesehen und den englischen Link angegeben. So kannst Du also auch diese URL benutzen: http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/ *g* *g*
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Post by GeoTrail »

Code: Select all

yes maybe, but my windows media player also crashes, and it dosent crash just the app as in linux, but takes my whole explorer.exe down.!
Might have something to do with your installed codecs.
Anyways, looks like this subject is very old and arguing about the two is useless. Both have good and bad sides.

I set my period (.) here and end it from my side. Wanna fire up a peace pipe instead? :P :lol:
I Stepped On A Cornflake!!! Now I'm A Cereal Killer!
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Post by merendo »

I set my period (.) here and end it from my side. Wanna fire up a peace pipe instead?
Yes, of course! But not with tabacco, but with something else :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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Post by GeoTrail »

merendo wrote:
I set my period (.) here and end it from my side. Wanna fire up a peace pipe instead?
Yes, of course! But not with tabacco, but with something else :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
He he he I second that :)

Damn, didn't think this wanna gonna be such a HOT topic :lol:
Kinda like the north and south going to war. Useless, pointless.

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I Stepped On A Cornflake!!! Now I'm A Cereal Killer!
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Re: Linspire

Post by Max. »

I am somewhat fed with Lindows (Linspire now). When the project started, I signed up as (paying) supporter, but over time, the goal changed so much and doesn't have much to do with the initial goal back then.

As out-of-the-box Linux I am not impressed as well.

My favourites:

1. Debian

Rock solid and once you understood the concept very easy to maintain and update.

I love installing from a 30MB ISO image with not much more on the box than network, a console and a SSH server. After that, you easily install only the needed things via apt-get - works like a charm in no time.

2. Knoppix

Best to impress Windows junkies and an excellent tool for far away locations where you need a nice working environment. Also well suited for reviving/diagnostic a broken PC or to get web access to download necessary drivers after you had to reinstall Windows again.

3. SuSE

Very good in supporting new hardware, very quick and easy graphical installation. Good manual (at least in the professional version). Sadly a bit bloated, but that's ok if you want to use it as client, not as server.
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Post by Raven »

Linspire (formally Lindows), does try to give Linux a nice simple interface for everyday users.
For anyone who is just wanting a cheaper alternative to Windows and doesn't really do much because standard junk, like Word processing or Playing Music. It is an extremely great build...

Infact it is probably the one build I would actually recommend for home use, even over Red Hat. Simply because it is one of the hardest distro's to crash, the user gets little to no low-level access (which means no instability caused by morons who think they know what they're doing) plus the driver support is excellent.

However, Linspire is despised as a Linux build by the Tux Community.
The reason being is that it isn't opensource (that's like a capital Linux sin!!)
It is far too commercial (no free build, that's almost as bad as the first sin!!)
It is actually a practical home user OS ... this is actually a 'bad' thing aparently.

Unfortunately Linspire isn't really well spread to actually be used much outside of the Linux communities which means, that all thier good intensions go to pot. There is another build of Linux I remember which emulates Windows XP almost flawlessly, runs Win32 exe's and DirectX 8.1 ... but for the life of me can't remember it's name.
Again it breaks all the cardinal Linux rules, and the biggest one of all

It has an EULA, I mean for a Linux user that is just unspeakably evil and dare i say it, Microsoft-esqué.

-/-

Some points raised in this thread though are valid on both sides.
Yes Linux is far more insecure and far more prone to virii, however how vunerable is more down to the Linux Admin in charge. This said the exact same can be said about Windows.

I also saw someone complaining that Microsoft update this OS every few years and so you've got to keep up with the times.
Well actually yes and no. It was only last year with DirectX 8.1 becomming the gaming standard and .Net 1.1 finally becomming a standard for Windows platforms that everything shifted from Windows 95 -> Windows 98 becomming the minimum Operating System.

Although business-wise Windows NT has really evolved every 2years making it radically different from the last version, this won't affect many home users because thw Windows 9x series really didnt' change or become incompatible with any of the other builds.

The only reason Linux programs on the whole will run on any build, is because you compile them specifically for your machine. Depending on your machines speed for something like OpenOffice this can take between 2-12hrs. This is ontop of copying and downloading the files in the first place, which again can be quite a long download considering it's 250MB total.
When you compare this with Installing OpenOffice on Windows,
a) it'll install in under 5minutes
b) the redistributable is <50% the size of a *nix build (the source often is far far larger)

There is also another problem that will creep into the Linux one which Windows doesn't have (even .Net applications that Compile-On-Demand) and that is user error compiling. Although distro's like Gentoo and RedHat provide you with simple installation procedures you can still accidentally tinker with something in the source and 'blam!' instant Linux problems.

This extends with the fact that Windows is designed to crash. I know there is alot of joking and snide remarks from anyone who says 'Micro$oft' and 'Winblowz' about how it is unstable because it crashes.
Well Windows is design to do that to protect your hardware from damage, you can actually over-ride it's self-crashing if your experienced enough.

See when both Windows and Linux crash (neither are even close to as stable as Unix/AmigaOS so this happens... alot), in order to prevent bad calls made to hardware; Windows will be like "Right somethings not working correctly, we'll dump the ram and reboot the system." or it simply locks the system from accessing anything.
Either way a Windows user will swear at the machine press reset and get on with thier day...

The same thing happens to a Linux user and your not quite sure what will happen because the system reports the fault to SH, but it'll just continue with whatever it's doing.

Something as Simple as Media Player, silent crash no biggy.
What if your were using a File Manager? If those calls it is doing to your hard disk are not properly managed, it can do some pretty damn aweful things to your system.
This can go as far as to actually destorying your hardware itself.
(This I know from experience)

Whilst I will say, Linux is a nice platform. It's communities sheer will to make sure it is OpenSource, and editable by any tom, dick or harry whilst using thier system. Without a qualified Admin (which lets face it, it is harder to find a Linux expert than it would be to get Microsoft to release the next home edition of Windows for free.
(anyone makes a comment on Windows XP 64bit i'll slap you :-p it's not free it's a 365day trial hehee, just cause they release updates every 8months which restarts that trail means nothing hehee)

Until the Linux communty can get it's act together and start producing set specification standards like was originall intended, which Unix 3.0 seems to have and Linux doesn't... it will remain exactly where it is.

Anyone who puts down that Microsoft is against any Operating System other than thier own. Remember it is only Linux they are against.
Microsoft actively support QNX, MacOS, Unix(OpenBSD), Irix (Solaris) and AIX.
.Net Support is due for those Operating Systems for when 2.0 is finally given a WHQL. This will open up alot of the market for Microsoft products running natively.

There is just far too much bad press around Windows imo, simply because is it created by Microsoft. For some reason Microsoft is seen as the devil.
Really the company to me just seems naturally all american, very large, trying to dominate through quantity and it's executives are obviously in it for the money.
That doesn't mean the hardworking grunts have anything to do with that, and they're the people who are actually creating the software.

:) Really, if anoyone has had the chance to use a G4/G5 Macintosh with MacOSX, well sorry but that OS really has to be one of the best there is.
Can't wait until PureBasic jumped over to the X-Side hehee
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Post by Beach »

Really, if anoyone has had the chance to use a G4/G5 Macintosh with MacOSX, well sorry but that OS really has to be one of the best there is.
Without question. I'm running Panther now but I bet Tiger will be even better (hard to imagine).
Can't wait until PureBasic jumped over to the X-Side hehee
Maybe this will be the surprise Fred has in store for us when he returns!! :twisted:
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