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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:48 pm 
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fsw wrote:
After reading a few reviews about M1 hardware/software I suspect that (with the help of Rosetta 2) PureBasic compiled x86 apps might work just fine.

it's not a solution anyway, Rosetta 2 will be dropped in several years.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:33 pm 
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deseven wrote:
fsw wrote:
After reading a few reviews about M1 hardware/software I suspect that (with the help of Rosetta 2) PureBasic compiled x86 apps might work just fine.

it's not a solution anyway, Rosetta 2 will be dropped in several years.

Are you sure about this?

If this is true then the only way for PureBasic to serve future Macs would be to add another backend.
Now it has ASM and JS... will LLVM be next?
Or if it's easier, clone the JS backend and modify it to export C or Go...

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:14 am 
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@fsw: Do you mean SpiderBasic as „JS backend“?

Fred said he is already working on ARM target. Maybe that is the M1 support?


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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:51 am 
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Danilo wrote:
@fsw: Do you mean SpiderBasic as „JS backend“?

Yes Danilo, this is what I meant.
In my simple mind SpiderBasic is another backend of the same core PureBasic uses.

Danilo wrote:
Fred said he is already working on ARM target. Maybe that is the M1 support?

Thanks for the link, didn’t know that.
Wasn’t in this forum in several years, so I missed a lot probably.

Besides an ARM backend the TouchBar UI needs to be addressed as well.
As far as I remember PureBasic cannot handle macOS devices with TouchBar properly because of internal workings of the PureBasic UI core.
(Maybe changes were made in my absence, I don’t know)

Also the ODBC interface is broken after PureBasic versions 5.4x...

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:34 am 
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fsw wrote:
Are you sure about this?

As sure as you can be when talking about Apple. First Rosetta was released in 2005 and deprecated in 2009, this time Apple says the whole transition will take "about two years", so probably with 2 years of support on top it will be the same 4 years in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:44 pm 
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deseven wrote:
fsw wrote:
Are you sure about this?

As sure as you can be when talking about Apple.

Good point.

deseven wrote:
First Rosetta was released in 2005 and deprecated in 2009, this time Apple says the whole transition will take "about two years", so probably with 2 years of support on top it will be the same 4 years in total.

IMHO you are spot on with this as well.

Apple has a vision, and sometimes they follow this vision no matter how big the collateral damage.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:02 pm 
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@wilbert
I wonder if you could install macOS Big Sur on a VM using Parallels Desktop?
I successfully installed Catalina on a VM in my mid 2010 Mac pro
have not used the Mac much since I bought a x64 PC with Windows, but I think I will give it a try


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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:14 pm 
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Should go.
With me High Sierra runs as VM under Parallels

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:50 pm 
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fsw wrote:
After reading a few reviews about M1 hardware/software I suspect that (with the help of Rosetta 2) PureBasic compiled x86 apps might work just fine.


Many report that Rosetta 2 is not an acceptable solution.
Large number of software packages won't install/not compatible or if you mange to get something working it could run up to 50% normal speed or be sluggish and unresponsive.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:52 am 
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Paul wrote:
Many report that Rosetta 2 is not an acceptable solution.
Large number of software packages won't install/not compatible or if you mange to get something working it could run up to 50% normal speed or be sluggish and unresponsive.

Any sources for that? I saw completely different reports.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:52 am 
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jack wrote:
@wilbert
I wonder if you could install macOS Big Sur on a VM using Parallels Desktop?
I successfully installed Catalina on a VM in my mid 2010 Mac pro
have not used the Mac much since I bought a x64 PC with Windows, but I think I will give it a try

My Parallels was very old so I tried it with VirtualBox.
I got BigSur running. A bit slow but it works.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:45 pm 
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deseven wrote:
Paul wrote:
Many report that Rosetta 2 is not an acceptable solution.
Large number of software packages won't install/not compatible or if you mange to get something working it could run up to 50% normal speed or be sluggish and unresponsive.

Any sources for that? I saw completely different reports.


Just do a search for 'M1 honest review' and instead of getting a review sounding like Apple gave the exact same script to each 'fan boi' reviewer telling them to praise the new hardware, you see reviews like this...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmoorhead/2020/11/21/apple-macbook-pro-13-m1-reviewwhy-you-might-want-to-pass/?sh=37d05135786a
https://mspoweruser.com/too-good-to-be-true-plenty-of-software-not-compatible-with-apple-m1-laptops/

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:37 pm 
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Paul wrote:
Just do a search for 'M1 honest review' and instead of getting a review sounding like Apple gave the exact same script to each 'fan boi' reviewer telling them to praise the new hardware, you see reviews like this...

Um... You're talking about biased reviews while posting a link to a website called "mspoweruser" which mostly mirrors the Forbes article author's twitter? Interesting.
Well, there is a community list of app compatibility with Big Sur/M1 in case you want to see real data collected by real users.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:52 pm 
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deseven wrote:
Um... You're talking about biased reviews


Best of luck then :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Big Sur and PureBasic
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 11:19 pm 
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I don't think you understood me correctly, but sure, let's not dive into that.

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