It is currently Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:21 am

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 64 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:58 am 
Offline
Addict
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2003 8:26 am
Posts: 2942
Location: Planet Earth
grabiller wrote:
That's odd. Works perfectly well here.

@Wilbert
@Danilo
Do the sprites show (at the right place) when the application start, before you do any resizing ?

No.

grabiller wrote:
@Danilo
Did you tried to use the opengl subsystem in the compiler options ?
Did you tried the executable from the link I gave ? Same result ?

OpenGL is default on MacOS.
Win64 executables don't work on MacOS.

grabiller wrote:
Btw, I'm using v5.20 b13 here on Windows x64.

I'm using v5.20 b15 here on Mac OS X 10.8.4


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 9:02 am 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:38 am
Posts: 309
Location: France - 89220 Rogny-Les-Septs-Ecluses
Ok I didn't rememberer you were on MacOSX.

This seems to be a PB bug on MacOSX to me.

From the source code, I see no reason why it would work on Windows and not on MacOSX, both using OpenGL.

Would be interesting to see what happens on Linux.

_________________
guy rabiller | radfac founder / ceo | raafal.org


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 9:20 am 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:38 am
Posts: 309
Location: France - 89220 Rogny-Les-Septs-Ecluses
I've just tested it with v5.20 b15 on Windows x86 & x64 with OpenGL subsystem.

Works as expected.

_________________
guy rabiller | radfac founder / ceo | raafal.org


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 9:56 am 
Offline
Addict
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 5:52 am
Posts: 3487
Location: New Zealand
I just get a window on linux 5.20b13 x64
the screen only shows if you change it to less than or equal to the window size


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:10 am 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:38 am
Posts: 309
Location: France - 89220 Rogny-Les-Septs-Ecluses
Thanks for the Linux input.
Looking at the documentation there seems to be nothing that prevent to have a WindowedScreen larger than the parent Window.
Is it a bug ? A limitation ? Or are we not supposed to create a WindowedScreen larger than the parent Window in any case ?


Btw, I just realized that we can only have one WindowedScreen per application, not even per Window.. (or did I missed something?). As my application must support multiple Windows, this is a showstopper anyway, and here, I don't see any possible workaround.. :cry:

I think I'll have to stick with the CanvasGadget for now, waiting for a possible solution to have usable hardware accelerated surfaces for this kind of application.

_________________
guy rabiller | radfac founder / ceo | raafal.org


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:31 am 
Offline
Addict
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 5:52 am
Posts: 3487
Location: New Zealand
I think the screen size issue is a gtk limitation on linux

if you want multiple openGL viewports you'll need to resort to native openGL
or use some library like clutter

there's a glAreaGadget for linux
and it would be easy enough to do the same for windows but I've got no idea about OSX


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 11:16 am 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:38 am
Posts: 309
Location: France - 89220 Rogny-Les-Septs-Ecluses
Yes I could use an alternative library, even the old mighty SDL.

And really, I don't mind using external libraries but for the windowing management, this is really the back bone of any graphical application, so if I have to do it for this, I'll loose all the benefit of every PB 'build-in' features related to windowing, drawing, events, etc.. It's almost like going back to plain C/C++ then.

This is very frustrating because everything I need for the GUI is in PB except for these hardware accelerated (multiple) windowing issues.

So for now my choices here are:

1) Using CanvasGadgets, no issue here except I won't get hardware accelerated surfaces.
2) Using the WindowedScreen but I'm allowed to only one Window (plus the resizing workaround is finally not allowed on Linux/MacOSX).
3) Using an external library but then I have to code everything myself and not use the PB windowing/drawing/event/etc.. built-in features.

See the frustration ? :cry:

_________________
guy rabiller | radfac founder / ceo | raafal.org


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 3:44 pm 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:16 am
Posts: 584
Location: Belgium
Quote:
This is very frustrating because everything I need for the GUI is in PB except for these hardware accelerated (multiple) windowing issues.

So for now my choices here are:

1) Using CanvasGadgets, no issue here except I won't get hardware accelerated surfaces.
2) Using the WindowedScreen but I'm allowed to only one Window (plus the resizing workaround is finally not allowed on Linux/MacOSX).
3) Using an external library but then I have to code everything myself and not use the PB windowing/drawing/event/etc.. built-in features.

See the frustration ? :cry:


Yep,

That's what I am doing for several years now for my CAD/CAM/CNC program,
(re)designing and (re)writing everything myself, and yes, it is almost C++.
after my last test with 'canvas gadget', my last step is converting it all from 'canvas gadget' to sprites ...
You lose all the benefits of PB ...

Marc

_________________
- every professional was once an amateur - greetings from Pajottenland - Belgium -
PS: sorry for my english I speak flemish ...


Last edited by marc_256 on Mon Sep 02, 2013 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 3:50 pm 
Offline
Administrator
Administrator

Joined: Fri May 17, 2002 4:39 pm
Posts: 14009
Location: France
There is some examples to have a GL area on your window for Linux and Windows. You could probably add Cocoa one as well

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=48860&hilit=opengl
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=49583&hilit=opengl


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:06 pm 
Offline
PureBasic Expert
PureBasic Expert

Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:21 am
Posts: 3606
Location: Netherlands
Would it be possible to combine the canvas and screen ?
I'm thinking about a windowed screen on an invisible window, use the accelerated screen to composite everything, grab the output and draw that onto the canvas. :?: :?: :?:

_________________
macOS 10.15 Catalina, PB 5.71 x64


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:13 pm 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:16 am
Posts: 584
Location: Belgium
Hi wilbert,

Quote:
Would it be possible to combine the canvas and screen ?
I'm thinking about a windowed screen on an invisible window, use the accelerated screen to composite everything, grab the output and draw that onto the canvas. :?: :?: :?:


I'm working for 4 years now on my software, and I tested all this things,
thats why I'm working 4 years now, not only the program itself, but all that testing !!

- Why copying something you have on screen in to a canvas gadget ??

I wrote my own 'CLIPPING' routine, so you can draw it all in separated boxes.

Edit: I'm rewriting it all, and I need tons of variables for all that.
Example: For a box, I store the PosX, PosY, Width, Height, FrontColor, BackColor, ScaleX, ScaleY, ...
So, if you want to 'Resize' it, I use the 'Scale' to redraw it.

And yes, it is a lot of work,
but if you want a professional looking program, you have to do it ...


marc,

_________________
- every professional was once an amateur - greetings from Pajottenland - Belgium -
PS: sorry for my english I speak flemish ...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:25 pm 
Offline
PureBasic Expert
PureBasic Expert

Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:21 am
Posts: 3606
Location: Netherlands
marc_256 wrote:
Why copying something you have on screen in to a canvas gadget ??

The only reason would be that the events the canvas offers are useful.

_________________
macOS 10.15 Catalina, PB 5.71 x64


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:41 pm 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:16 am
Posts: 584
Location: Belgium
wilbert,

this comes from the first post,

Quote:
A free and open source, cross-platform 3d application framework intended for professional work, and an alternative to blender.


So, what you need is speed, speed and speed ...
every time you convert from one to another, you lose time ...
Even in my program, written now using sprites (hardware accelerated) , speed is still very critical ...

If you want to edit MESHES, I have meshes for more than 1.000.000 vertices and 100.000sts of faces.
In an mesh editor you have to draw all these lines(edges) and points(vertices)
so, every time you rescale, or rotate your mesh, you need to recalculate these points.
Not to forget the detection of the mouse for selecting these vertices or edges.


Marc,

_________________
- every professional was once an amateur - greetings from Pajottenland - Belgium -
PS: sorry for my english I speak flemish ...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:59 pm 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:38 am
Posts: 309
Location: France - 89220 Rogny-Les-Septs-Ecluses
Fred wrote:
There is some examples to have a GL area on your window for Linux and Windows. You could probably add Cocoa one as well
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=48860&hilit=opengl
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=49583&hilit=opengl

Thanks for the links Fred, those are definitively interesting.

Understand though (but I think you do already), and I'm speaking also for Marc I think (I hope you don't mind Marc), that the real issue we have here is not really how to create and handle an hardware accelerated surface (OpenGL/DirectX..). I think we both know how to do this in C/C++.

The real issue we have here is that, in fact, by doing this, we loose the very beauty of PureBasic and its features. We loose all the integrated Events system, we loose all the Drawing features, etc.. And what is very frustrating is that PureBasic does not miss a lot of things to correct the situation.

In fact almost nothing: We just need either a hardware accelerated CanvasGadget or the possibility to have multiple resizeable WindowedScreens.

That's basically all we need, really, and we are set !

Marc had the courage (congrats) and possibly the time to recode everything to handle his needs, I don't. Or lets say, in this case, I would rather prefer to do it straight in C/C++. But I want to stick to PureBasic because of its simplicity, its beauty and its 'easy' cross-platform nature.

PureBasic has 99.9% of what we need to tackle this kind of applications, we just miss this last 0.1% 'thing' :wink:

_________________
guy rabiller | radfac founder / ceo | raafal.org


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raafal - a cross-platform 3d application framework proje
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 5:50 pm 
Offline
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:16 am
Posts: 584
Location: Belgium
Quote:
PureBasic has 99.9% of what we need to tackle this kind of applications, we just miss this last 0.1% 'thing' :wink:


Yep,

maybe if we ask very gently :)
for 6st of December 8)
a hardware accelerated canvas gadget :mrgreen:

marc

_________________
- every professional was once an amateur - greetings from Pajottenland - Belgium -
PS: sorry for my english I speak flemish ...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 64 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

 


Powered by phpBB © 2008 phpBB Group
subSilver+ theme by Canver Software, sponsor Sanal Modifiye