PB install on Mac costs $99?

[RoseWilliam]

I am planning to buy a Mac. Could someone clarify if I need to buy the Apple Developers license at $99 per year to install and run PB on the Mac. The instructions say install the SDK from the cd/dvd that is supplied with the Mac. IF the disc is not supplied then I can download the SDK from the Apple Store, but it implies that I need the license to download it. I do not want to buy an expensive Mac and then find I need to pay $99 a year to use PB on it. I intend to use PB on the Mac for my own use. I am not intending to publish any apps. All I need to know for now is:- Can I install PB on the Mac for free? I will tackle the installation problems if/when they arise.

[Keya]

i think you have to sign up for an Apple ID in order to download XCode (free) which is required to run PB on OSX, but i dont recall having to pay for that i thought it was free (im not sure if its necessarily a Developers Id or just an Apple Id), i think the $99/yr full developer id thing might be for putting your apps in their store? but you can just put them on your website instead if you want. You dont necessarily need to buy a Mac either, you can use Virtualbox (free) or VMWare ($) to install and run OSX from Windows, works for my budget plus makes it easy to switch back and forth when writing for multiOS

[collectordave]

Having just bought a MAC mini I can say it is free. The $99 is to place your Apps in the APP store you become a registered Apple developer.

With PB on the MAC it gives you the same freedom as on a windows machine you develop your app and distribute it yourself.

My amazement came when some of the programs I had written for the windows machine in PB worked straight out of the box on the MAC. Others just had some little quirks but nothing insurmountable.

P.S. Liked it so much just bought myself a MACBook pro as well!

[Danilo]

Xcode is freely available in the Mac AppStore. Info:
- https://developer.apple.com/xcode/
- https://developer.apple.com/xcode/ide/
- https://developer.apple.com/xcode/download/

- https://developer.apple.com/
- https://developer.apple.com/app-store/

The Apple Developer program for releasing into AppStores is that $99 thing:
- https://developer.apple.com/programs/

As long as you don't want to release into the AppStores, or sign your applications, everything is free.

[Shardik]

You dont necessarily need to buy a Mac either, you can use Virtualbox (free) or VMWare ($) to install and run OSX from Windows, works for my budget plus makes it easy to switch back and forth when writing for multiOS

Sorry, but you should also state that you are not permitted legally to install OS X in a virtual machine except on Mac hardware using Mac VM software, and even then only the server version. Any other usage is a violation of the terms of service because you are only allowed to download and use OS X when owning an Apple Mac computer...

So the best way to go (when money is a problem) is to buy a used Mac Mini. Then I would suggest to install Bootcamp and Windows and/or Linux and you will be able to develop cross-platform applications with PureBasic. I won't suggest to use virtualization because you may experience problems in virtualized environments which you won't have with native OS installations. And I don't tell you this because I don't have any knowledge with virtualization (I am working as a VMware and Hyper-V administrator for huge server clusters with hundreds of VMs). But what is working fine and reliable for servers often doesn't work as fine for plain virtualized desktop VMs.

As a cross-platform developer it is hard enough to develop cross-platform applications and I don't have the time to fight against problems caused by incompatibilities in desktop virtualization...

[Keya]

I don't have the time to fight against problems caused by incompatibilities in desktop virtualization...

what sort of incompatibilities or problems have you experienced?

I don't have the ability to run my OSX apps on Mac hardware, but of course the hardware itself is virtualized, and I haven't experienced any problems running virtualized so i can't see any reason why one of my programs wouldn't run fine on a normal Mac if it runs fine on a virtualized Mac? (none of my apps are low-level hardware-related though! simple general desktop utility stuff)

and yes Apple will get their money from me (El Capitan is free tho!) when i get a developers ID and sign and sell apps at their store i guess later this year, hey they should just be thanking me for developing my apps for their OS also instead of snubbing them!, but no i cant afford to buy new HARDWARE from them too (hey its their stupid design choice to be so heavily hardware-locked compared to Win/Linux PC-friendliness♥!), some of us have tight student budgets, so i don't really have a choice but to virtualize but im happy with the setup and like i said its quick to switch back and forth from Win/Linux/OSX which i find a handy timesaver - plus i can easily connect/disconnect network like i do our beloved Windows 10. (OSX likes phoning home too according to Wireshark!)

ps. i just remembered, no i dont think you even need to sign up for XCode (which as stated is free), you just need your webbrowsers user-agent to claim its Mac-based (thankyou firefox plugin), otherwise you just get stuck in "You must be logged into your Mac to download this app" infinite loop

[wilbert]

what sort of incompatibilities or problems have you experienced?

I'm using Parallels on my Mac for virtualization.
I'm happy with it but one thing for example is that all virtual machines are limited to OpenGL 2.1 .

[Keya]

oooh i hadnt thought about any opengl/directx/3d stuff (im too bad at 2D to even try lol), but yes i dont think i would feel comfortable releasing an app of that type without testing it on Mac hardware first!! but for 'general desktop utilities' im sure the vast majority will work just fine on a real Mac if they work fine virtualized!

[Shardik]

and yes Apple will get their money from me (El Capitan is free tho!) when i get a developers ID and sign and sell apps at their store i guess later this year, hey they should just be thanking me for developing my apps for their OS also instead of snubbing them!

The OS X releases are only free for Mac owners - otherwise you are using a pirated copy! Apple is earning its money in the PC sector by selling hardware. If you don't own a Mac and you don't like Apple's policy - simply don't approve that policy by developing software for OS X...

..., but no i cant afford to buy new HARDWARE from them too (hey its their stupid design choice to be so heavily hardware-locked compared to Win/Linux PC-friendliness♥!), some of us have tight student budgets, so i don't really have a choice but to virtualize but im happy with the setup...

It's the same argument I am hearing for more than 35 years... If you can't afford a Porsche, you won't go stealing one, would you?

I know tight student budgets probably even better than you: during my time at the university doing my diploma thesis and 6 years doing research as a doctoral candidate I was married and had up to 5 children during that time. So I had to earn enough money for my children and my wife (looking for the children and therefore being not able to earn money herself) - so you can imagine that our financial budget was probably much less than your current one...

So in my opinion independantly of your financial situation it's not legal to steal an OS only because it's easy to trick Apple into believing you are using OS X.

what sort of incompatibilities or problems have you experienced?

I have never tried to virtualize OS X but I have experienced problems with different Linux distributions by myself and by Linux users in this and other forums. These are mostly inexplicable graphics problems in themes or the graphical user interface. As soon as I come to know that a Linux user is using a VM I'm out in helping (the same as Fred who stated in several threads that he doesn't support PB problems in VMs because these problems should be reported in the respective VM support forums).

To avoid problems with virtualized Linux distributions I decided to setup a Linux test PC with 22 different Linux distributions all running natively on that hardware.

[Keya]

thanks for telling me off, the downloading a free OS vs stealing a Porsche comparison is... interesting... but you're right - poor Apple doesn't have enough dollars from students to send to their Cayman Islands account under the name of a Nominee Director, after they've sent it back and forth in a Double-Irish Dutch Sandwich to pay zero tax (you mentioned stealing?). I won't ask you how many Porsche's you've stolen but can I ask have you ever listened to a pirated mp3 or downloaded a pirated movie? (I'll be honest - I have - and you were a student too, so don't tell me you never did... in other words you're just being a hypocrite ).

Am I really breaking Apple's books though if use a VM instead of buying a $99 second-hand Mac from a pawn shop in order to develop for Apples customers? I'll still be paying the $99/yr Apple Developer fee, which is $99 more than Windows and Linux charge me to make my apps available to their customers. Apple should be paying me $99

[Fred]

I think it's going a bit off topic here, please get back on topic

[Keya]

i apologize. ive had my fair chance to say my 2c anyway so i will shoosh now!

[RoseWilliam]

Thank you to everybody who responded to my question. I now have the answer I need. I know I don`t need the Mac specifically. I have a Windows machine and PB works fine. As I am 68 next month I thought I would spend the kids inheritence and treat myself to a Mac. Next time someone asks if I use Windows or Mac I can say I have both.
Do I need to mark this post as closed?. If so how do I do it?

[Fred]

No you don't need to

[jack]

does one need Xcode or just the command line tools or both ?